Next Level Soul Podcast Episode 305
What does it take to live without fear? Michael Bernard Beckwith tells Alex Ferrari how a childhood glimpse of something bigger, and a dream that felt like dying, set him on a lifelong path. He shares why he believes the world and the planet are not the same thing, why he calls lovers the true revolutionaries, and how asking better questions can change what you see.
Key Takeaways
- Michael says his spiritual journey began with mystical moments as a child, which he tried to hide so he could fit in.
- He describes a lucid dream in which he died, and says he woke inside a presence of love and beauty that changed his life.
- He draws a line between the planet, which he calls Gaia, and the world, which he calls an agreement we make through our beliefs and perceptions.
- He teaches that you can wake up by asking empowering questions, meditating, and noticing the lies you tell yourself.
- He says right now the true revolutionaries are the lovers: people who forgive, stay kind, and keep their hearts open.
A Mystical Start, and the Urge to Hide It
Michael says his spiritual journey was not a conscious choice. As a child he had mystical experiences, but as a kid and a teenager he tried hard to normalize them so he would not seem weird to his peers. He knew something had happened. He just did not know what it was.
He shares a moment from age eleven. Visiting his grandmother in Washington, DC, he was shopping in a store when he saw in his mind’s eye that a worker was about to drop a bottle of baby food. He ran around the aisle and caught it before it hit the floor. The worker asked how he knew. Michael says he could not explain it.
Walking home with the groceries, he saw his mother, uncle and grandmother smiling at him from the stoop. He remembers thinking, “I’m not who they think I am.” They saw a son, a nephew and a grandson. He felt he was something else, with no words for it. So, he says, he became what he thought he should be for them, and closed everything down.
The Dream That Changed Everything
Years later Michael was a senior at USC, a psychobiology major headed for medical school. He says he was having a series of spiritual experiences, but at the time he thought something was wrong with him. He believed it might be a psychological pathology.
The experiences peaked in a recurring lucid dream. Three men were always on the horizon coming after him, a little closer each night. One night they were close enough that he could see their faces. In the dream, two of them held him down and a third stabbed him in the heart with a serrated knife. Michael says the pain was excruciating, physically and emotionally, and that he died.
When he woke, he says, he could see that everything was surrounded by a presence of immense beauty. His name for it was love, and he says it was beyond anything he had felt as a human being. He says he could never fit back into the box he had been given.
A search for answers
Michael then went on what he calls a research journey to understand what had happened. He found the mystical teachings of the Buddha, Jesus, the Dhammapada, the Upanishads, Sri Aurobindo and Walter Russell, and he began to see similarities in how awakenings are described. He had left church at sixteen and says he did not use the word God at first. Later, he says, he could use it again, because it no longer meant a man in the sky. It meant a presence of love, beauty and intelligence.
From Practitioner to Agape
People liked being around him, Michael says, and they began to receive healings and counseling from him long before he knew there was a career called spiritual therapy. His mother and a friend finally talked him into visiting a metaphysical church, even though he insisted there was no truth going on in church.
The teacher was Dr. Daniel L. Morgan of the Guidance Church of Religious Science. As Michael walked into the sanctuary he heard him say that heaven and hell are not really places but states of consciousness. Michael thought, “He’s right.” He enrolled in a class the next day and became a full-time practitioner, seeing six to eight people a day, six days a week. He then went to ministry school, which he says took him five years to finish a three-year program, because he was not trying to graduate. He just loved learning among like-minded people.
Michael later founded the spiritual community Agape. He says it is in its thirty-seventh year, and that people who once thought he was crazy now ask him to hold them in prayer.
When Awakening Feels Like a Crisis
Alex asks what he would tell listeners who are going through something similar and feel afraid. Michael points out that classes in transpersonal psychology did not exist forty years ago. He says good books on the subject can help you see that what looks like a psychological crisis is sometimes a breakthrough.
His advice is to lean in rather than panic. He suggests finding a good spiritual therapist or an authentic shaman, not a weekend one, to help you walk through it. His message to anyone in that place is that they are not going crazy. He says they may be gaining their mind. He is clear it does not apply to everyone, and that sometimes support is appropriate. This is Michael’s view, not medical advice, so if you are struggling, please talk with a qualified professional you trust.
The World Is Not the Planet
One of Michael’s favorite teachings is the difference between the world and the planet. He says the planet is Gaia: three fourths water, rain, forests, oceans, lakes and rivers, and she is alive. The world is something else. It is an agreement we all make with each other through opinions, points of view and perceptions.
He says two people can stand on the same spot of the planet and live in two different worlds, based on their beliefs. He ties this to the quantum field, where, he says, many things can occupy the same space at different vibrations. Some people live in a world of peace and gratitude, and others live in fear, doubt and resentment, in the very same place.
Why the News Feels Darker Than Reality
Alex asks why so many people feel the world is going to hell. Michael offers two reasons. First, what once sat on the edge of the conversation is now central. He points to Bruce Lipton, whom he calls the godfather of epigenetics, and to quantum scientists who now use the word consciousness, often in language close to the mystics. Second, he says the news travels instantly now, and most of what the media reports is the lowest common denominator of human experience. You rarely hear about the resolutions, truces and wars that end.
He says it is a contorted view of reality, because a man who sits meditating and decides to forgive his family does not make the evening news. He is quick to say an optimist is not someone who ignores challenges. An optimist, he says, is someone who knows there is a solution to every challenge.
Vibration, Attraction and Your Gut
Alex asks about vibration in everyday terms. Michael says birds of a feather flock together: hold a certain frequency and you tend to find people at a similar one. He adds that we have a body but we are not a body. We are more vibrational beings. His advice on gut feelings is that if you listen with your whole being, your first mind is generally right.
What It Means to Wake Up
Asked how he defines an awakened person, Michael says the word spiritual has nothing to do with religion. It is interchangeable with eternal. An awakened being, he says, has come out of sleepwalking, out of the hypnotic spell of believing they are separate from source, love and intelligence.
He uses images to make the point: the wave waking up to the fact that it is one with the ocean, and the sunbeam realizing it cannot exist without the sun. He says this is startling to the ego, because the ego lives in separation and creates it for survival. Once you move past the ego’s view, he says, you realize you are one with a flower, with all human beings and with the Earth, and you want to take care of her.
Near-death, or “near life”
When Alex mentions that near-death experiencers come back changed, Michael says he calls them near life experiences. He says the testimony is always much the same: we are here to perfect our loving, and we were never actually separated from life. Alex hopes we do not have to die to get that shift. Michael replies that the old religion said you had to die and go to heaven, while the new spirituality says you die to your littleness and have heaven here and now.
Why Is This Happening Now?
Alex asks why awakenings seem to be happening at this point in history. Michael says there is an intensity of necessity. He points to the climate emergency, polluted and overfished oceans and disappearing rain forests, and says crisis can lead to a breakthrough. He also says some indigenous cultures prophesied that what was once secret would become open.
He uses the caterpillar as a metaphor. When the caterpillar turns to liquid in its chrysalis, the imaginal cells of the butterfly begin to emerge, but at first the caterpillar’s immune system kills them off because they are foreign. Eventually they multiply faster than they can be destroyed. Michael says we are in the early stages of something similar, and quotes Buckminster Fuller’s idea that you do not destroy an old system, you make the new one so strong that the old one falls away.
The lovers as the true revolutionaries
Michael says love is not popular right now, but it will come back. He says the true revolutionaries on the planet are the lovers: the people who forgive, who have compassion and kindness, and who keep their hearts open, even when others call that soft. He contrasts them with people who try to prove themselves through ego and force.
Collective Awakening and Free Will
Alex asks about humanity’s consciousness as a collective. Michael says the Buddha, Jesus, Kuan Yin and others placed the template of an awakened being into what he calls the noosphere, and that thousands of people are now seeding it further. But he stresses that no one is simply pulled along. We have sovereignty and free will, and each of us has to say yes.
He says we were made in the image and likeness of God, which does not mean we look like God, since God is formless. It means we share a faculty: we can think independently of our circumstances, and we can birth a new life out of an idea. He calls this conscious evolution, where we take part in our own growth through meditation, affirmative prayer, life visioning and time with high-minded, open-hearted people.
He credits The Secret for planting seeds, and notes that people now openly read transformational books they once hid behind paperback covers.
The Biggest Obstacles to Awakening
Asked about the biggest challenge, Michael names hatred. He says many people do not realize they are being hypnotized into hating others, whether over skin color, orientation or which side of an argument they are on. In his view this divisiveness keeps people from seeing how powerful they are. He illustrates it with an old Star Trek story about beings who fed on hatred between two crews.
The second obstacle he names is strict materialism: the belief that if you cannot see, taste, touch, smell or hear it, it is not real. He jokes that such people are dimensionally challenged, living a whole life in just three dimensions. He says a crisis or a near-death experience often shows them something beyond the senses. He compares relying only on the senses to walking with prosthetics instead of your real spiritual sense.
How to Take Part in the Shift
Michael offers a few practical ways to start.
- Notice the question you are living in. He says unconscious questions like “What’s wrong?”, “Who’s to blame?” and “Why me?” put a filter over your perception. Try asking, “What good is here that I cannot see yet?” or “What gift is trying to emerge through me?” He says the universe answers those questions.
- Meditate. He calls meditation extremely important.
- Catch the lies. He says most people carry lies picked up from past hurts, such as “No one likes me” or “I’m never good enough,” and that a lie acts as a law until it is neutralized. He says the truth is that we are all worthy and unfolding perfection.
- Undo the imprints. Alex notes that Bruce Lipton talks about the first seven years of programming. Michael agrees that a child in an alpha state absorbs beliefs from the people around them. He calls the moment you begin to decide what goes into your awareness a second birth.
Reconciling Religion and Awakening
Alex asks how people with traditional religious backgrounds can open to a consciousness shift without feeling their foundation crack. Michael says that when people are in pain, they start asking new questions. He suggests they go back to the original teacher, study his or her own words rather than the religion built around them, and see for themselves. He says many people are discovering the difference between the religion about Jesus and the religion of Jesus.
Speaking your best friend
Michael shares a story about advice from Dr. Howard Thurman, the mystical theologian he met while at Morehouse College. Thurman told him that when you are put in a place where people may not understand you, just talk about your best friend. Michael once gave a eulogy for his grandmother in the church his great-grandfathers founded, with skeptical ministers sitting behind him. He spoke about the teachings of Jesus, and says that little by little the ministers started saying “Amen.”
Alex’s Closing Questions
Alex ends by asking Michael the questions he asks every guest.
- A fulfilled life: being on the edge of your unfolding, growing, becoming more yourself, and giving. He says if you are not living on the edge, you are taking up too much space.
- Advice to his younger self: Michael shares a vision from age twenty-six, when he was driving to speak and wondering what to do with his life. His future self told him to keep doing what he was doing. Years later, he says, he had the vision from the other side, and wept in his driveway. To his eleven-year-old self he would say, “Don’t shrink for the world.”
- God: love, intelligence and beauty, a presence that is everywhere and never absent.
- The purpose of life: to reveal the presence in your own unique way.
His parting message is that you are a unique emanation of life itself, nothing is missing in you, and the answers are within you.
Spiritual Takeaways
- Notice which world you are living in; you can change your beliefs without changing your address.
- Ask a better question today, and see what answers arrive.
- Write down one old lie you carry and ask what is true instead.
- Practice forgiveness and kindness as an act of courage.
Please enjoy my conversation with Michael Bernard Beckwith.
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Frequently Asked Questions
Who is Michael Bernard Beckwith?
Michael Bernard Beckwith is a spiritual teacher and the founder of the Agape spiritual community in Los Angeles. In this conversation he shares his story as a teacher, speaker and author with host Alex Ferrari. He says Agape is in its thirty-seventh year, and that he taught for several years before founding it.
How did Michael Bernard Beckwith’s spiritual journey begin?
He says it started with mystical experiences as a child, such as seeing in his mind’s eye that a bottle was about to fall. As a teenager he tried to normalize these moments to fit in. His life changed after a lucid dream at USC in which he felt he died and woke inside a presence of love and beauty.
What does Michael mean by the difference between the world and the planet?
He says the planet is Gaia, a living Earth made of water, forests, oceans and rivers. The world, in his view, is an agreement we make with each other through our opinions, perceptions and beliefs. He says two people can stand on the same spot of the planet and live in two very different worlds.
What does Michael say about vibration and the quantum field?
He says that in Newtonian reality two things cannot occupy the same space, but in the quantum field many things can at different vibrations. He uses it to explain why some people live in peace and gratitude while others in the same place live in fear. He also says we tend to attract people who share our frequency.
What advice does he give to someone going through a spiritual awakening that feels frightening?
He says that books on transpersonal psychology can help you see that some crises are breakthroughs. He suggests finding a good spiritual therapist or an authentic shaman to help you move through it. He also says it may not apply to everyone and that support is sometimes appropriate, so speak with a qualified professional you trust.
Why does Michael call lovers the true revolutionaries?
He says love is not popular right now, but those who forgive, show compassion and keep their hearts open are doing the real work of change. He believes love will come back and become popular again.
How can I take part in the shift in consciousness, according to Michael?
He offers several ways to begin. Notice the questions you live in and swap disempowering ones like “Why me?” for empowering ones like “What gift is trying to emerge through me?” Meditate, and notice the lies you tell yourself, which he says act as law until neutralized.
What does Michael say about religion and awakening?
He says the teachers behind the religions, such as the Buddha and Jesus, taught something different from what was later built around them. He suggests going back to the original teacher and studying that teacher’s own words.
What are the biggest obstacles to awakening that Michael names?
He names being hypnotized into hatred of other people, which he says keeps people divided and unaware of their own power. He also names strict materialism, the belief that only what the senses can detect is real.
How does Michael answer Alex’s closing questions?
He defines a fulfilled life as being on the edge of your unfolding and giving to others. He describes God as love, intelligence and beauty, a presence that is never absent. He says the purpose of life is to reveal that presence in your own unique way, and that he would tell his younger self not to shrink for the world.
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Follow Along with the Transcript
Michael Bernard Beckwith 0:00
So we have a contorted view of reality based on what we're presented by the status quo every single day. And then I would also add one other thing than that is, there's a difference between the world and the planet. They are not synonymous. And I teach this all the time because people will say, Oh, what's going on in the world what's going on and planet Earth? They're not the same thing. The planet is Gaia. Three fourths water, rain, forests, oceans, lakes, rivers, Earth, and she's alive. And then there's the world. The world is an agreement that we all have with each other, we have opinions, points of view perceptions. positionality is agreements, when you agree upon something you live in that world.
Alex Ferrari 0:58
Like to welcome to the show, Michael Bernard Beckwith. How you doing Michael?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:02
I'm great man, everything. You know, one of my favorite statements, regardless of whatever is going on in life is how can you get better than this? And the universe will answer that question. Whether you're in the throes of a challenge, or whether you're in a burst of an epiphany. How can you get better than this right now? That's where I met. How can I get better with them? And with you, man, life is good.
Alex Ferrari 1:25
I appreciate you, my friend. Thank you so much for coming on the show. I have been a fan of yours. Probably since I was introduced to you back in the olden days with the secret.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:36
Movie still has legs man,
Alex Ferrari 1:37
Man, isn't it amazing?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:40
It's amazing. I go out into the world to speak. And then you have different generations. Just, starting to listen to it, or read it or see the video. And it's just like waves. And then some of the old timers are going back over it again. Because they missed something or it's an interesting dynamic that I've been in. I've been in more movies than any spiritual teacher, I got an award for. I didn't even know that until somebody pointed out to me. And that one is is one of those that just really changed a lot of lives.
Alex Ferrari 2:13
Absolutely without question. So my first question to you today, sir, is how did you begin your spiritual journey?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 2:19
My spiritual journey began. It wasn't a conscious situation. Even though as a child, I had certain spiritual awakening certain mystical experiences. But as a kid, and growing up even as a teenager, I would quickly try to normalize myself to be with my peers. So something happened. I knew something happened. I didn't know what it was. And I just didn't want to be weird. So I quickly tried to normalize my awareness. And I remember when I was 11 years old, I was. I was in Washington, DC. I'm from DC, originally, but raised in LA. And I was back during the summer with staying with my grandmother. And it was it was around my birthday. And I had gone to the store to pick up something from my grandmother and I was in one aisle. And all of a sudden, I could see that the individual who was stocking food in the aisle next to me, was about to drop a bottle of baby food. I could see it in my mind's eye. So I ran around there really fast, and I caught it before it hit the ground. And he looked at me and he said, How did you know it was gonna fall? I said, I didn't know I didn't I couldn't explain it. I said, No, I just saw him. So anyway, I'm walking home that day. But with the groceries, my mother, my uncle and my grandmother are sitting on the stoop, watching me walk in their direction. They're smiling at me, you know? And I'm thinking to myself, I'm not who they think I am. My, my grandmother thinks I'm her grandson. My mother thinks I'm her son. My uncle thinks I'm his nephew. But I'm not. I'm something else. I didn't have any words for it. And so I'm getting closer and closer to them. I'm saying what am I going to do? What am I going to do? And I became what I thought I should be for them. I literally became the nephew, the Son, and the grandson. And I just kind of quickly closed everything down. So fast forward. I'm a senior at USC. I've transferred from Morehouse College, and I'm in the psychobiology major. Right before that I had had had had an experience that catapulted me to USC, I didn't know what it was. But anyway, when I went, went there, I was gonna go to med school. And I'm giving you a cliff note version here. Sure, sure. Of course. I'm starting to have a series of spiritual experiences. But the time I didn't know that's what it was. I thought it was psychological pathology. I thought something was wrong with me. So I stopped smoking weed, just to ensure You're there, I wasn't going crazy. But the experiences intensified culminated with this lucid dream that I had for a nice period of time in which these three men were always on the horizon coming after me, but they were always in the distance. But every night, they were a little bit closer. So one night, they were very close, I could see the outlines of their face. And I looked to my right, and I could see this small tent 1000s and 1000s of people trying to fit into this very small tent. And, but I knew everyone in line, and I said, these guys can't hurt me, I have all my friends here. And one by one, they turned their back on me. Two of the men held me down, and another man stabbed me in the heart with a serrated knife, the pain was excruciating, physically, and emotionally, and I died. And when I woke up from that, I could see that we were, we're surrounded by this presence of such immense beauty. My name for this presence was love, beauty, the love that penetrated my being was beyond anything I'd ever experienced humanly. And I never could fit back in the box that I had been given intimations of as a kid, I couldn't get back in my box anymore. And that changed my life. And I went on to, on a research journey to discover what had happened to me. And then that's what I bumped into the mystical teachings of the Buddha, Jesus, the Christ, the Dhammapada, the apana shots, Sri or Bindu, Walter Russell, and I began to see there was similarity in these awakenings that had happened. And my life was never the same. After that my trajectory of my life became all about having a more conscious connection with this presence. At the time, I didn't use the word God. At the age of 16, I left the church, it didn't hold anything. For me, I didn't believe all of those religiosity around around Jesus. And so I just called it love beauty. Later on in life, I was able to use the word God again. Because it didn't mean the guy got the sky guy, it didn't mean the man in the sky had no morphic qualities, it was all a presence of love and beauty and intelligence and, and that's the short version of how it took a number of years to integrate. And then years later to discover that there was actually a career called spiritual therapy. Because I had been doing it without any licenses or anything, because people liked being around me, they would get healings, I would do counseling, and there's some wonderful stories around that as well. And then I went to this metaphysical spiritual community, at the behest of my mother, and a friend named Alyssa. And I had said to them, I'm not going to any church church, there's no truth going on in church. And they kept begging me to kiss them is this metaphysical? This is not like a regular, you're going to hell and fire and brimstone and any of that kind of stuff. So I went. And the gentleman was named Dr. Daniel L. Morgan, and he had started the guidance Church of religious science. And I was walking into the sanctuary, I heard him say, heaven, inhale, are not really places their states of consciousness. And I said, he's right. This this truth being spoken in a church, this is unheard of. Anyway, sat down, listen to him. The next day I was in, I was enrolled in one of his classes. And I found that there was something called a spiritual practitioner was a licensed spiritual therapist. They ended up taking that I think at the time it was the two year program. Wow. And I took that I became a I became full time practitioner, I did that. I saw six to eight people every single day, six days a week, had seminars before they were popular. And in my end, and then ultimately went to the School of higher consciousness school of ministry graduated took me five years to graduate from a three year program. Because I wasn't trying to graduate I was just like, like join just I just like being a learner and hanging out with like minded people, you know, so So that's kind of the cliff note version of, of what happened in then little by little by little, you know, I ended up starting a spiritual community and took off it's continuing to grow even now. We grew exponentially during the lockdown, and now I just among full times, I'm on for full time service mode. How can I serve you I should have never asked that question.
Alex Ferrari 10:01
Be careful what you wish for my friend,
Michael Bernard Beckwith 10:04
Okay, I be of service and the universe keeps showing me ways that I can be of service. And I keep saying yes.
Alex Ferrari 10:10
So Michael, when you had some of these mystical experiences, and you were kind of questioning your sanity, what would you what advice would you have for people who are listening to the audience who might be having these kinds of spiritual awakenings within their own lives, and they, they really can't kind of understand it, there's much more information about it. Now, obviously, it shows like this than it was when you were having it. But still, it could be extremely scary. What advice would you have for them?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 10:35
Well, first of all, today, as you said, you know, we have, you have classes in transpersonal psychology, that didn't exist 40 years ago, you know, this was all woowoo stuff, you know. And so any good books on transpersonal psychology will allow you to see that what looks like a psychological crisis is actually a breakthrough. So I would say one, don't try many people, particularly in the Western world, when they're going through an inner crisis of awakening, they think this many people still think is pathological, and they'll get drugs, they'll get some kind of pharmaceutical drug to kind of stop it. So they can have some kind of servcies from the experience, and they're actually, at least in many cases, stopping the energy of their transformation. I'm not saying that that's happening for everybody. Sometimes it might be appropriate for somebody to do something to alleviate the inner turmoil and pain they're going through. But in many cases, there are openings taking place, and people are afraid of it. And instead of leaning into it, finding a good spiritual therapist, to help you walk through it, or an authentic shaman, not the slide by night shamans had go to Peru for two months, they call themself a shaman. But a real one didn't help navigate through this kind of spiritual awakening, which I think at this time in human history is happening more frequently. You know, it's in the newest fear of the planet. It's, it's, it's, it's vibrationally trending. And, and so I will let people know, they're not going crazy. You know, I worked with an individual a couple of years ago, who was having a full on kundalini awakening. And she was about to be put on a whole lot of medication. And her husband was very, very nervous. And, and when I, when I met with her, I said, Oh, I could tell this was not she was not losing her mind. She was gaining her mind. And, and I worked with her for a few days. And she started integrating the higher frequencies. She was actually bringing some very powerful knowledge through her intuition was at an all time high. And subsequently, she didn't need any medication. She just got, she got balanced. And now her and her husband are really good friends of mine, they were business partners, they were actually and and she's doing great, she's, she's tapped in some very powerful genius within her, but she was asked to be put on medication. You know, unfortunately, I was able to step in and show and to her and her husband, this was not to be medicated. This was to be embraced. Because the next version of herself was emerging. You see?
Alex Ferrari 13:27
Yeah. Well, you said, the, the more and more of these awakenings are happening now. And I would agree with you, I've even in the last 10 years, that information that is these conversations, you know, this, like when we talking about the secret, you know, that was one of those movies that kind of shifted consciousness in many ways it dropped seeds.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 13:50
It was absolutely dropped seeds. Yes,
Alex Ferrari 13:52
It dropped seeds to start the bigger conversation. What do you think is happening in this, this kind of global shift? That is consciousness that we're all going through? Right now? Because if we look at the world, so many people are like, Oh, the world's going to hell, it's worse than ever. There seems to be so much more uprisings and wars and politics and all this stuff. It seems like everything's going to hell. But in another perspective, it's not it appears so can you explain your from your perspective?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 14:23
Well, first of all, that which was peripherial years ago, is now becoming a part of the central conversation. So you have two things happening on the planet, you have that which used to be woowoo. You now have Bruce Lipton, the Godfather, epigenetics, you have quantum scientists, using the word consciousness that we're all holographic expressions of a one of a one source. So one presence you know, using the interchanging with mystical language, you see, and this is all part of the Gestalt, the language, the information is now flowing freely. You know that a lot of indigenous cultures prophesied that this time, all that used to be secret, would now be available openly everywhere. And that's we're living in that time. So you have that, combined with the fact that the Earth itself is vibrating at a higher frequency, the Earth is more alive, whether you look at that from a shaman point of view that speaks about the earth being alive in the mother being awakened, or whether you speak about it from a scientific point of view, you watch the human scale, or you watch the vibration of the Earth, it's actually going to a higher frequency. And so all of that is combining to create an atmosphere of awakening. For those who choose it. I mean, it happens, but you still have to do the inner work to actually choose to break free from the status quo. So that's going on now. Now, it appears that things are going to hell in a handbasket. And I don't know where we get handbasket from. But anyway, however, you have, you know, something called the internet, you have these news media's years ago, it would take a few days before a news item would begin to catch around the world. Now it's instant. So if something negative happens, and another part of the United States as a part of the world, you get the information. And most of the information we get via the media is always the lowest common denominator, the human experience, you don't get the resolutions, you don't get the mediations, you don't get the truces, you don't get the wars that are ending. I mean, we're, we're at an all time low in terms of wars on the planet, you know, historically, yet people would think that we're at an all time high in terms of wars, but we're not, you know. So I mean, there are factors that are using food as war and whether it's for war things that particular nature, that's another discussion, but so the appearance, everything going to hell is not true. And secondly, the appearance also is actually what I feel to be more of a birth pain of another dimension rising or another expression of grid rising, you have the collective consciousness being aired out, so to speak, that which was hidden under the rug psychic, in our psychic context, is being now becoming visible. And so and being reported on, if somebody is saying crazy stuff, they're going on the news. If somebody is just a regular old guy sitting in the room, meditating and not creating any havoc, they're not going to be on the news, you know, oh, Joe, sitting in his office today, and he's meditating. And he had a tremendous insight about the President's he decided to forgive his family. That's not gonna be show up on CNN. But if Joe gets mad and shoots up somebody, oh, Joe's going on the news, you know? Yeah, absolutely. So. So we have a contorted view of reality, based on what we're presented by the status quo every single day. And then I would also add one other thing, and that is, there's a difference between the world and the planet. They are not synonymous. And I teach this all the time, because people will say, Oh, what's going on in the world what's going on with Planet Earth, they're not the same thing. The planet is Gaia. Three fourths, water, rain, forests, oceans, lakes, rivers, Earth, and she's alive. And then there's the world. The world is an agreement that we all have with each other, we have opinions, points of view perceptions. positionality is agreements. When you agree upon something you live in that world, you actually create. And in end up condensing your beliefs into that world experience. Two people can stand on the same spot on the planet would be in two different worlds, based on their beliefs based on their perceptions. So there are many people living in a world of peace, a world of harmony inside, a world of joy, a world of thanksgiving and gratitude. And there are many people living in survival. There are many people living in fear and anxiousness and anxiety, all occupying the same space, in hertz. In quantum reality, that's called the condensate you know, it's like, in Newtonian reality two things cannot occupy the same space. But in the quantum field, many things can occupy the same space, they vibrate at different levels, you know, and so there are many people living at a different vibration living in a different world. And there are people living in another vibration living in a world of fear and doubt and polarity and eight resentment, animosity. But what's being reported, generally the lower frequencies, that's what's being reported why the reporters don't live in the higher frequencies. They are actors. reading what they're supposed to report. So they're not even, they're just reporting from an old paradigm. You're a reporter from the new paradigm. Individuals that have these kind of conversations, were beginning to report from what's trying to emerge, whereas the old reporters are reporting from the status quo. And if it bleeds, it leads. So all of that allows me to be very optimistic. I mean, an optimist is not a person doesn't see challenges. An optimist is simply a person that knows there's a solution to every challenge. So I live in that frequency. Yeah.
Alex Ferrari 20:39
So is that why podcasts of certain frequencies are getting more attention and more viewers and more listeners than traditional media by landslides? I mean,
Michael Bernard Beckwith 20:51
Absolutely. It's it's not sanitized by sponsorship that say you can't speak about ABC or D. I was with I was at the Milken Institute, I think was last year, speaking there, and Ben Jones was speaking there as well. I went to a dinner with him and a bunch of people with just me and him. He was bunch of folks, and he was the speaker there. And somebody asked him a question about, you know, his position on the news. And I can't remember what the question was, but he said this. He said, listen, the news is curated. I'm on CNN, somebody else's on Fox, somebody else's on they're all speaking to a demographic. If I happened, he said, If I happen to agree with a statement, that a friend of mine is saying, and he's actually a reporter on Fox, I'll get in trouble. If I say I agree with so and so. Because I, I'm not supposed to agree with that. Or if he hears something that I says and he says, Oh, I agree with ban, he can't say, he says, in fact went on to talk about that. But he went on to say, you know, basically, if you want to get really good information, he said, go to a podcast that you trust, the people that are doing real good research. And really speaking, he says that's where the new territory is. It's in the podcast. Because the news that we see it's, it's curated to a demographic. And that demographic is going to hear what they already believe they're not going to get anything outside of the present paradigm. And the sponsor is going to sponsor that. So I agree with what you just said, The podcast is the territory where people can begin to get new, new, groundbreaking insights and revelations about spirituality about science, whatever.
Alex Ferrari 22:39
Yeah, right, because there's no, quote unquote, agenda that not all shows, but some shows like what we do is we try to bring their variety of people like yourself and near death experiencers, a quantum physicist, and in an ancient civilization story, it's all of it just to kind of start a different conversation. And I never thought of it that way. But you were throwing out new ideas that just are not sanitized, and are introducing new ideas that you would have never even thought about. So it's really fascinating.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 23:08
Not going to hear it on NBC buddy.
Alex Ferrari 23:10
No, you
Michael Bernard Beckwith 23:12
Really do a very special niche. Today, we're going to have the good news from so and so he's right, it's always at the end, the moment it gives you like a two minutes of it,
Alex Ferrari 23:22
They saved the cat out of that tree. Now back to the war. Now, you said a couple of times in our conversation vibrations, now I understand what you mean by different vibrations at different higher levels in the quantum field, both having something stay at the same place at the same time, but at different vibrations. Is that why? To kind of kind of bring it down to earth for people who might not understand that concept? Is that what people are attracted to certain kinds of people like yourself, like you said, people like to be around you, you like to be around other like minded people is that more like you're being around people who are at the same vibration as you are?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 23:59
It's in particle, it's, it's, you know, birds of a feather flock together, you know, if you are holding a certain vibration, the frequency, you're going to magnetize and radiate and discover those kinds of individuals. And oftentimes it feels like you've know each other, you know, it's like you're kind of coming from a similar source. You've had different insights and revelations and you know, we have a body but we're not a body we're more vibrational beings and we are anything else. You know, we this is mainly water or a similar as a certain special kind of water that's within us. And then the rest is all frequency and vibration. You know, and this is why if people listen if they're if they're, if their biome is clean, and they're you had in their gut is clean, they can have a gut reaction to something they can be around somebody and this feels like, I don't want to be around. I don't want to go into business with this person. know, he's sounding really good. But I think there's some canine teeth behind those that don't, you know, they can say no, I'm not that or you can meet somebody else. And it doesn't look like the type of person you'd hang out with, but you just feel like very closest person can be a partner, a friend, business associate, you know, the vibration is simpatico, you know, and the frequency is high. And if you listen, with your being, you're generally right, the first mind is generally right. Yeah.
Alex Ferrari 25:33
From your point of view, how do you define a spiritually awakened person, all these awakenings that are happening? Well, how would you define that from your perspective?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 25:42
Well, when I first of all it, finding the word spiritual, is not has isn't has nothing to do with the religion, the word spiritual, eternal, these are all interchangeable. So we're all spiritual beings. We're all eternal beings that have emerged from the eternal. So a spiritual being an awakened being is one who has who has awakened to that they've come out of sleepwalking. They've come out of the mass hypnotic spell of believing that they're separated from their source, separated from the Divine separated from love, intelligence, beauty. They're not living on an island thinking they're separated from life. When you start to have an awakening, you start to realize, Oh, you're one with this lifeforce. There is no separation, the wave is waking up to the fact that it's one with the ocean. The sun beam is waking up to the fact that it's emanating from the sun's not a sunbeam can even exist without the sun. The wave can't exist without the ocean, we can't exist without being emanations of a presence. That is never an absence. So you wake up to that. And it's startling to the ego. Because the ego lives in separation. You know, it creates separation for survival. But then when you transcend the ego perspective, you realize, oh, my God, I'm one with this flower. I'm one with all human beings. I'm one with Mother Earth, let me take care of her. Let me be a good steward. I'm one with the presence. And that's not blasphemy. It's what's blasphemy is to limit your perception, and to limit the presence in your life. But when you open yourself up to oh, I'm one with all of in life, capital L life, you know, I'm one with life. We magnify it, we glorify it, we let it flow through us, in beings that you mentioned near death experiences, you know, I call them near life experiences, you know, that when people in the testimony is always pretty much the same. We're here to perfect our loving. We've never been separated from life. Even though we may have had the experience of separation, it was just the hypnotic experience wasn't real. So when we wake up, we realize, oh my god, I'm one with this tree over here. And one with the ground beneath my feet, is only oneness. There's only unity. Everything else is hypnotism. Everything else is an illusion. And illusions can produce experiences. And experiences can be suffering, or painful. But they're temporary. That which is eternal, is each and every one of us living as a spiritual being. So we wake up to that. It's a wake up call, oh my god. I've been running around in life. anxious and afraid about something that didn't even exist. Yes.
Alex Ferrari 28:40
Right. Well, that's why that's my near death experiences, most of them that I've spoken to, if not all, come back completely changed with this exact awakening when they get the glimpse that though, oh, this is an illusion, we are here to be one with everything it is become transformed, ya know? So hopefully, we don't have to die to get this transformation.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 28:59
Well, that's the thing. I mean, the old the old religion was you had to die and go to heaven. The new the new spirituality is no you die to your littleness. And you have heaven here. Now.
Alex Ferrari 29:10
Let me ask you, Michael, when you had that lucid dream, and those three men, two of them holding you down one stabbed you did you literally have to die, and then come be reborn to this new awakening of who you are now.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 29:24
That was that was my experience. It's not everybody. No, of course, of course. But it was it was very painful. And when I woke up, it shifted occurred. And it occurred so dramatically, that most of the friends that I had that particular time I lost the friendships without I freaked out. And because they knew me more as a revolutionary, you know, change the world by any means necessary. I was a part of, you know, different groups to help change the world according to our particular perception. You know, I was selling weed at the time to find my way through you USC you know, and everything stopped. I was like, cold never got high again. I didn't drink any alcohol again, I wasn't a big alcohol drinker anyway, but no, I never smoked again, you know, just fell off it just. And I lost my friendships. And there was a period of time where I was, I was alone. I wasn't lonely. But I was alone. I didn't have a lot of friends. But, you know, I can remember this two things. One, I went to all the people that I've been running with at that time and letting them know that the spiritual world does exist. It's not a figment of my imagination. Who the things I used to do, I don't do anymore. And then they fell off. Then I went over to another friend's house. His name was Reggie. His wife was sitting in the living room standing in a living room, I walked in and I said, Listen, I've had this experience changed my life. There really is another dimension of living. There are many, many dimensions of life. I've been traveling. There are other beings. In Debbie's just nodding at me and Reggie is coming down the hallway. And Reggie says, I believe you. I've been thinking along those lines. So he became my running partner. And we were already friends since we were childhood. I thought I was about to lose him too. Because he was very revolutionary. You know, he's working with the Black Panthers. And, you know, religion is the opiate of the people, you know. And he said, I believe you. And so he became my running partner. And we did, we went to the every guru, all the meditation retreats, we took Silva mind control. We did, we did everything together. And eventually he changed his name to Nirvana, you know, and he became a minister. He's passed over now. But yeah, and then the other thing that happened was I was sitting, I used to work for the mayor of Los Angeles, I worked for Mayor Bradley Bradley, I was the I handled all the senior citizens affairs in the eighth councilmatic district. But I was by myself, I was a weirdo, you know. And I had the spiritual awakening, I was weird to everybody. I was teaching metaphysics at lunchtime to people who wanted to know about it. And one day, I was sitting at the field office, I was having lunch outside, and I looked up, and I saw this big ball of light with beautiful colors in it. And I was just staring at this ball of light and wondering what is that? And then if my eyes focused, it was a person. And I was looking at her aura. Wow. And I went up and talked to her. And she was a member of self realization fellowship. And she was a meditator. And that became one of my first friends. Because we understood each other. She was, you know, and novitiate have a fairly open mind. And I was, on my own, practicing and curating my own experiences, we became really good friends. So that was like one of my, those two people were one of my first couple of friends on the path that I knew instantly from my heart. Yeah.
Alex Ferrari 33:05
So Michael, why do you think that these awakenings are happening happening at this moment in history is a general and we've spoken about the vibration of Earth, but is that what is causing this fight? Because I mean, like we talked about 40 years ago, 30 years ago, this, there's nothing like this. There's no conversation and let alone 100 years ago, you and I would have been, we would have been hung up.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 33:30
The women, the women would have been burned at the stake and the men would have been crucified very much, very much. That's that's the archetype.
Alex Ferrari 33:37
Pretty much, pretty much. So why do you think.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 33:40
What what's happening now is you have an intensity, of necessity. It's like with the climate emergency that we're facing the pollution, the ocean that's being overly polluted and overly fished. Rain Forest is disappearing. There are systemic issues, the prison industrial system, politics is nuts, you have junior high school, people in the office is creating more and more polarity like they're in. They're in junior high school, know, who's to blame, who's to blame? Who's to blame, you know, the, you know, so the ego, what kind of people run for these offices, and you have a few statement statements in there. But, you know, you know, three fourths of them have received money from pharmaceutical companies, you know, in Congress, you know, so you have all these junior high school people just trying to feed their gluttony. So you have all this stuff happening on the plane, not just this is not just America, you know, Great Britain, is it a little better than we are in terms of the politics and other other countries? So I think that when there's a there's a there's a crisis that's leading to a breakthrough. You know, if you look at the often used metaphor of the caterpillar going to the butterfly, you know, the caterpillar eats, runs out of food starts to spin it's it goes into its cook And when it becomes a liquid, the imaginal cells of the butterfly begin to emerge. The imaginal cells are initially killed off by the immune system of the caterpillar, it kills off the new, the new cells that are going to birth the caterpillar. Because it's foreign. It's different, that ultimately, the imaginal cells proliferate so fast that it overcomes the caterpillars immune system and a new creature is born out of the chrysalis comes a different creature, it can fly it's a butterfly. Well, I think we're in the throes of an emergence of something new. But the the the the imaginal cell, I mean, the defense system of the old is is killing off the new you know, calling them crazy quacks whack jobs. There's, there's no science behind the near death experience, you know, etc, etc, etc. Whether it's newness in health, with alternative means of healing oneself notice in education, whatever the they're still, they're still seem to be on the skinny branches on the fringe. But it's proliferating when it's called alternative is proliferating. Until as Buckminster Fuller would remind us, it's not about destroying an old system. It's about allowing the new system to emerge and making it so strong, that the old just kind of disintegrates because the new is taking over. So I think we're in the, we're at the, we're in the beginning stages of something new emerging, and it will proliferate, it will magnify, until there will be a different kind of way we deal with each other love will come back, we'll come back and be popular again, love is not popular right now. I always say you know, right now, the true revolutionaries on the planet are the lovers. Those who love those who keep their heart open, those that forgive those that have compassion and kindness, that people think that soft, those are the true revolutionaries, the ones that are trying to fight and keep guns and shoot people and rob people and be a macho and ego. The whole that's they're not revolutionary, revolutionaries are the lovers. You know. So I think that this is what's emerging at this time in human history.
Alex Ferrari 37:35
Now, we'll be talking a little a lot about the individual awakening. What is your perspective on humanity's consciousness as a collective and how we are all either agreeing to this on a different vibrational level to do all of this? Would you agree with that statement?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 37:56
This there's different levels to that, yes, those individuals that have said yes, or participating in their own evolution, or seeding the consciousness the same way that Katana the Buddha has already asked her. Jesus Kuan Yin and other individuals hundreds of years ago, put into the newest fear the template of an awakened being that still here that vibration is still here. Now you have 1000s of other people emerging that are seeding the, the atmosphere, the environment. Now, individuals still have to choose that they're not just going to be pulled into the next frequency because they're here. At some point. We have a level of sovereignty, we have a level of freewill, we have to say yes to it, you know, we have to be interested in it. I teach that, you know, we've all emerged from the eternal from the eternal, but were made in the image and likeness of God, which means as mean, we look like God because God is formless. So it's, it's not like who I look like. It means that we share a faculty and that faculties that we're able to think, independent of an experience we can think, independent of a circumstance or a situation. So that everything that emerged out of nothing, there was not a grain of sand, this infinite intelligence, birth, everything out of nothing, but an idea. We have the same faculty, we can birth a whole new life out of an idea. So continuing with what I'm saying, we're at an old stage of evolution where we are, we evolve because of adjustments to the landmass and climate, to what is called conscious evolution, where we are participating in our own evolution. We are meditating. We are doing the life visioning process. We're affirmatively praying, we're hanging with high minded open hearted people. So even though individuals are seeding people still have to Choose to be interested in it. You have to you have to choose it. So I would say yes, there's a collective awakening happening. And more and more people are choosing to be interested in the awakening, which then makes them a candidate for insights and revelations.
Alex Ferrari 40:14
As your growth and my shows growth has is a testament to people are looking for this information. And how long have you add your church? And your
Michael Bernard Beckwith 40:24
Agape is in his 37th year. I've been teaching three, four or five years before I started agape. So I've been 4 decades in.
Alex Ferrari 40:34
So what was how was it changed?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 40:39
Now the same people thought I was crazy now come to agape,
Alex Ferrari 40:43
That guys, that's another knock on the door, can I come in?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 40:46
And now they're like, you know, can I meet with you? Can you hold me in prayer? You know, I'm gonna take a class, you know? Yeah, so there's just, it's just like, the conversation is here. Now, it's, it's, as you said earlier, you know, when the secret came, you know, that was a seed planting, you know, there's a lot of things that people can criticize about it, but you can't criticize the fact that, you know, you don't criticize the Model T, you know, you develop a new class. So you don't criticize the secret It was It jumped out there. You know. So now there's, there's more coherence around the ideas, there's more understanding about the action that has to take place, and etc, etc, etc. But today, there are more and more people who are interested, who are listening, who are going to classes who are going on their websites, and studying and going to spiritual communities and reading books and $2 billion industry. It wasn't a billion dollar industry. I mean, I used to say years ago, that people would read the spiritual books, but they would cover it with a paperbacks. Nobody knew what they were reading. And they would rather say they were reading porn. That is spiritual book, you know, right. It's a pornography.
Alex Ferrari 42:01
For you. Good for you, Joe.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 42:02
Okay. Yeah. Was it going? Oh, yeah. But now people will openly read, you know, transformational books, you know, life visioning, Deepak Chopra, Michael Beckwith, you know, Bruce Lipton, you know, they'll read it now, and not hide it. You know. So things have changed and are still changing rapidly.
Alex Ferrari 42:23
What do you think is the biggest challenge we have as a species and on the individual level, for this awakening, to continue to occur?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 42:34
Well, people don't quite understand that. Their hate for other people, whether it be color, the skin sexual orientation, which which side of the aisle you are on in terms of politics, they don't realize that their chain has been pulled there, they are actually being hypnotized into that hate. It's a part of how as a civilization is controlled, you create that kind of atmosphere, is it the level of self hate that's there. And then they train people unconsciously to project that onto other people. So that there's divisiveness in our society that keeps people from understanding how powerful they really are. And if enough individuals stood, how powerful they really are, they could change the status quo in an instant. So people actually think that they hate that person, or that person. They don't even know what to do with that hate came from somebody is a puppeteer actually controlling that. And that's, that's a big hindrance to evolution. People have to wake up. And it's interesting. I was, you know, I'm kind of a Trekkie. You know, I remember seeing this old Star Trek with Captain, the original Captain Kirk and the Klingons. And then we're fighting you know, how they do? Sure. And they go to this planet, and the Klingons are trying to take over this planet. And Kirk is trying to try to save this, these people. And they're, they seem totally unconcerned. That unconcerned. You know, long story short, these beings had already transitioned into living without a body, they could manifest the body whenever they wanted to, and they could be invisible, so they couldn't be hurt at all. And then subsequently, there was an energy there that thrived off of hate. That was creating the energy between the Klingons and the enterprise staff to be at odds with each other. So as long as that was happening, this other entity could survive and go strong and create havoc. And once they figured it out, in the Klingons in the in the enterprise staff started liking each other so they didn't want to be controlled by this other force. You know, that happens right now. You know, there there are groups of people that love them. fact that people don't get along. And people actually think they're thinking these thoughts. They're not their mind is being hijacked. And their hate, is it real? You know? So anyway, that's one of the that's one of the obstacles. Right? And we already talked about some of the systemic issues in our in our world culture that we're all facing simultaneously. And then there's still individuals who are materialist. Who if you can't smell it and see it, taste it, touch it or hear it, it's not real. And so we call these individuals dimensionally challenged. The only living in 3d, I mean, living a whole life in just three dimensions. Whoo, how boring, you know, and, and then what happens is either through a crisis or near death experience or something, they begin to realize that there's something way beyond the sensorium way beyond what you can see physically or hear audibly. It's surrounding us. That's, that's here, you know. So those are some of the things that are hindering our wider perception.
Alex Ferrari 46:08
It's so interesting. How Star Trek and for me, it was Star Wars. As you can see, I have a Yoda behind me. Yeah, like Star Wars two. Yeah. Yeah. But it's so interesting that both of those and stories in general and movies and books, their seat planters as well. And the seeds that were planted by Star Wars and by Star Trek, yes. Have been growing and growing free. I mean, the concept the Star Trek talked about in the wizard the 60s, right. When the show was originally aired.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 46:37
Yeah, there wasn't there was in the 60s, and they dealt with a lot of thing. Oh, before it was popular.
Alex Ferrari 46:44
Oh, you know, the interracial, the interracial kiss was the big one.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 46:48
And it was, it was it was it was, it was him and the two first interracial kisses were Harry Belafonte movies, and starred in Star Trek. Yeah. And people were upset. Well, not everybody. I mean, you know? Sure. Oh, I remember when was the lady's name big actor put her hand on her belly. It was her show. Yes. Oh, yeah. She sang down.
Alex Ferrari 47:15
Yes, yes. Yes. I saw that. I saw that documentary. Yeah.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 47:17
And they were gonna cut that out and she says the show's not even gonna gonna be aired if you could be touching Harry Belafonte, you know, yesterday, Star Trek and Star Wars, tune everybody to the fact that there was a force. There was right, there was a field is a rupture in the force. The force is with you. You know, that planted a whole seed about a presence that's with us. Soon with it, you see?
Alex Ferrari 47:45
Yeah, right. Yeah. And that's what cha Chi Chi, Chi energy or Chi energy and all that it's the same concept. But it's fascinating how these ideas get dropped into the mass media, and how it affects really the world in such a lot. I mean, I always used the matrix is one of those movies as well, that just absolutely shifted perceptions of reality and the whole, the whole thing of quantum physics now with the simulation theory and things, and this materialist that you were talking about quantum physics is throwing that all upside down, and they're fighting it. And they're like, no, no, no, no, that's not like but but here's the proof. Now, but that's not real proof.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 48:23
But they can actually they have they have telescopes, and microscopes that actually can see an electron.
Alex Ferrari 48:30
And between and between electron
Michael Bernard Beckwith 48:32
Between the and and show the movement of it based on thought and, and excetera. But some people if they can't see it, and taste it, smell it, touch it here, it is not real to them, and they're living life as an invalid. You know, they're living life on crutches basically, because the sense the sensorium, or prosthetics of this set of their spiritual sense, and they're living with your prosthetic rather than the real sense.
Alex Ferrari 49:00
What's the Galileo effect? It's the Galileo, don't look, don't look through, I can't look through the microscope. I can't look through the telescope and see that the sun is right. Now, what would you suggest for someone who wants to consciously participate in this shift?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 49:18
There's a number of ways to enter into we one of the quickest ways is to begin to become aware of what question are you living in? And that is, you know, we have questions that we ask all the time, consciously and unconsciously, and some are empowering, and some are disempowering. So the average unconscious person ask questions like what's wrong? Who's to blame? Why me? Which puts a filter over their perception so they can't see reality? If you ask a question, like, what good is here that I presently cannot see? Or what gift is trying to emerge through me? If you start to ask empowering questions, the universal presence via universal law will answer those questions. And you can begin to walk in your empowerment by asking, What gift is here that I'm supposed to give? What power is within me that's supposed to be unleashed, the universe will start to speak to you in a language and in a way that you can understand. And you will start to walk in the direction of your empowerment of your awakening. Now, of course, meditation is extremely important. Asking empowering questions is extremely important. Any introspective exercises that help you curate your questions, or to notice what lies you're telling yourself. What do I mean by that? Most people, they live with a series of lies, something happened to them, they experienced some kind of trauma in their life, and a lie happened. And that's supported. No one likes me. I'm unworthy. I'm never will be good enough. These are all lies. Now a lie acts as a law until it's neutralized. The truth is that each of us are spiritually heavy, spiritually merged from the eternal, all of us are unfolding perfection. We're all worthy. We're all up to receiving more good than we can imagine anything else is a lie. So if you begin to watch your mind, and the ego, you can begin to see the lies you're telling yourself that you've inherited from some experience that you were too little to deal with at the time. And you start to untangle those lies, until you begin to tell yourself the truth. And then you'll begin to see differently, your perception will change. And you'll begin to realize that you were looking at life through those lies that lens of the lies, rather than the the lens of the truth. So those are subtle ways that one can begin to, to open themselves up to the field of infinite potential.
Alex Ferrari 52:04
And is, like our friend, Bruce Lipton, who talked about those first seven years of programming, that's a lot of those lies come in those seven years, because your parents are gonna give you the same programming that they got. And they believed because you're pretty much almost an empty vessel. It's you know, you I always say, because I have kids, there's some programming at the factory, there is some some programming in the factory that come in, and you have certain traits and personalities. Yeah. But the belief systems and the beliefs of the world are programmed in those first seven years, and continue to be programmed afterwards. But the really intense part, it's those first seven years, right?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 52:43
Yeah, it's your the kids in alpha state, you know, and, and just picking up on everything, that wherever the parents are listening to on the news, the parents beliefs, what they've inherited from their parents in embryo was conversations that were being had, how they were improving, when they first came out, all that imprinting our mind in printing our consciousness, but we're at the stage of when we begin to wake up, we begin to decide what goes in our awareness. You know, we don't just allow the world to impress our mind, nor are we trying to have a relationship with the world, which I have relationship with our real self, which is eternal. Yeah. And then we begin to undo the imprints. And that's called being reborn. You know, you had your first birth, coming through the womb, then you have your second birth, when you have an awakening. Oh, I don't even believe that nonsense. What did I get? I was bad and unworthy. And that good enough? Where did that come from? It was a sea of mental garbage.
Alex Ferrari 53:47
Well, let me ask you this, then how do you reconcile traditional religious beliefs with this new consciousness shift? Because I've from my own experience, and from just being on the show so much, that when you rock someone's foundational beliefs, if they believe in reincarnation, and it counters what they've been taught all their lives in a in a traditional, or let's say, Christian, or Jewish tradition, or something like that. They can't believe one idea that's separate from that, because it starts to start to crack the foundation. And that's when all this fighting and all this, I have to kill you and you are wrong, and I am right, we are the chosen people, not you and all this ridiculousness. So how do people reconnect if they are interested in this awakening of consciousness, but have this baggage of traditional religious beliefs? How do you reconcile the two?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 54:36
Well, you know, a person is in pain or crisis. Eventually they start asking different questions. And they eventually come to an awareness that you know, the teachers, whether you're talking about Gautama, the Buddha, whether you're talking about yes, we're being Joseph Jesus, the Christ or any of them. You know, what they spoke of, is quite different from the religion that formed around on them, you know, so many people are, are coming to an awareness that they have been practicing the religion about Jesus, rather than the religion of Jesus, you know, Oh, that's great. And then, and once they do a little bit of study, they can say, Oh, I believe what Jesus believed. Now all this stuff built around him, you know, all this stuff about hell, and salvation and eternal determination, the rapture. Yeah, that that that was manmade, manmade, that stuff up, that didn't do anything with the teachings, you know, and there's fundamentalism in every religion, you'll find the fundamental isms in Islam and Buddhism in Christianity, you know, and so eventually an individual has to do a deep dive, and go and go back to the original teacher, wherever your culture is, you go back to the original teacher and just study his or her words, not the religion, his his or her words, you know, study the Bhagavad Gita, but meditate first, because it's metaphorical. You know, study Dhammapada, study the Bible, but only the New Testament, only the words of Jesus, you know, which is also been curated to a degree, you'll come to a different insight than if you study just the religiosity around it. And so many people, I mean, the churches are emptying out in droves. These young people don't want to go there anymore. They're not having a transcendental mystical experience. They're, they're being beat over the head about things and told, I mean, I went to a church recently, there was a young boy that was killed that died. His mother, metaphysical Father, father was a minister Baptist. So that's where the memorial service was. And I had an opportunity to speak there. But I forgot. I mean, he went, he went up when he started talking about, first of all women couldn't come to the pulpit. Women couldn't wear pants. Women couldn't have their head. They couldn't wear hats. And he started saying, well have we searched the scriptures and we don't think he's going to go to hell. by the, by the way, he died, he's not going to go to hell. So we're happy about net. And then he just talked it. It was almost like it was a performance art piece of the past, except that it was present. And it was really high. Right? It was like, well, people used to go to these kinds of churches. And I imagine some people still do. And I wasn't into heavy judgment about it. It was just more of what's going on. Just blessed him, Blessed everybody and said, you know, got out of there.
Alex Ferrari 57:59
The energy wasn't right, I guess, you know. So how did you navigate that? By the way? I'm just curious. How did you navigate your you spoke in front of them. So I just generalize it.
Michael Bernard Beckwith 58:12
I'll tell you a story that serves me well. And that is Dr. Howard Thurman, who was a great mystical theologian. He was mystical and he transcended Christianity. Met with Gandhi brought the nonviolent teachings back to Dr. King. He was kings mentor. And I met him I went I stayed in Thurman Hall. When I went to Morehouse College, I met Dr. Thurman. He said, I heard him say one day, you know, you're going to be put into places where people may not understand you, or they may even hate what you're saying. And he said, they said something along the lines of, you know, just talk about your best friend, which is the presence, this talk about your best friend. It could be the teachings of Jesus. So my grandmother had made her transition this a number of years ago, and I was invited to give a eulogy. And it was in the church, that my great grandfather founded my two great grandfather's found at this church, St. Luke's Baptist Church in Washington, DC. So my grandfather, great grandfather, Arthur chittister, and my great grandfather, Frederick, Greenwich. They were the founders of the church. So I'm speaking in this church, the, the minister of the church at the time, was upset that he wasn't doing the eulogy. And that I'd come from this weird religion. So I'm in the south, I didn't read I'd be there on time to do the service. I'm in the back room meditating. This is my grandmother's very close to her and meditating. And they come in I mean, it's like six or seven these ministers. He says, what, what is your, what is your, what is your philosophy? What is your theology, sir? And I'm, you know, I'm surely I'm meditating. This is my goal. Whether I have some sadness, move it through me, you know, what is your theology? And why are you speaking? I say, Well, you know, this is the church, my great grandfather founded and my grandmother was a member here. And they want me to do the service. And my theology is the teachings of Jesus. And they looked at me really weirdly, you know, like, we know that's not true, you know? So anyway, I go out to speak, and they're sitting behind me. And they're just stoic. You know, and this young guy, they're a little older. And I said, I remember Thurman's words. And I said, I'm going to talk about my best friend. And today, my best friend is Jesus. And I began to teach about the teachings of Jesus. I began to teach that the kingdom of heaven was at hand, the kingdom of God was with in all the teachings is telling to you as you believe, the ground upon which you were standing is holy, because you're standing there, I waited all into a eulogy about my grandmother and who she was, and that the spiritual qualities that she emanated are still alive, because they're God, given they're not human. You perfect them, but they're come from God. So she's still alive. Anyway, I started teaching all of this. And little by little, they start to, they start to Amen, brother. Oh, my God. Oh, go, you know, they went from being the sin hindering, and the Pharisees to an amen corner. So I pulled upon that vibration. When I spoke at this Baptist Church, I just spoke about eternal life, the teachings of Jesus encapsulated into this boy's life, and sat down. I wasn't going to not be me. You know, but I knew where I was. So I knew I would curate more of the teachings of Jesus. I didn't think that just about Jesus, but enrolled into a brief eulogy. And was all good.
Alex Ferrari 1:02:00
Yeah, it's a great story, Michael. Now, Mike, I'm gonna ask you a few questions. Ask all of my guests. What is your definition of living a fulfilled life?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:02:09
Living living a fulfilled life is being on the edge of your unfolding, it's, you're fulfilled, if you're growing. If you feel if you becoming more yourself, and growing and becoming more yourself, you become a generative being, meaning you are here to contribute, to serve, to give. That's a radiance of compassion, kindness, generosity, and whatever your gifted area is. Everybody can't do everything. But everybody is here to share and to give something. So you're not fulfilled. If you've just taken if you've just lived the life of acquiring stuff, you live the full life, you're living a full life if you're circulating if you're sharing and shining and radiating and giving, and being on the edge of greater discovery of who you are. So the idea is, you know, is to live on the edge. You know, if you're not living on the edge, you're taking up too much space.
Alex Ferrari 1:03:12
Yeah, beautiful, my friend. Now, if you could get into time machine and go back in time and talk to little Michael, what advice would you give him?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:03:20
You know, you're, you're asking me a question about something that happened for me for real.
Alex Ferrari 1:03:25
Okay, so where's that? Well, first of all, where is the time machine? And can I get it ride?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:03:31
I was 20. This was a little kid. That was 26 26 27. I had my spiritual awakening. I was three years into it. And I had been invited to speak at the senior citizens center in the valley. I didn't have any degrees at this time. This is just my copy, which liked me. They wanted to be around me, they want me to come speak. So I'm driving to the valley. And I'm wondering, what is my life going to look like? What What am I going to do with my life I had this awakening people like being around me. People are calling me for counseling, they're sending me donations, but nothing at formulated. It was just, you know, and I had a job. So I always remember this. It had been raining. And then the rain stopped in the sun part of the clouds. It's very beautiful day. And I had a vision. This vision, Michael. But my future Michael came to me and said, Michael, keep Don't worry about your future. Keep doing what you're doing. I'm here. I made it. I'm good. Just keep doing what you're doing. You'll be guided. And I came out of that somewhat of a trance and went to do the talk. Talk when fine. People love what I had to say. And so now fast forward, that was that was in the 70s late 70s And that happened. And so fast forward we're in the Late 80s, maybe early 90s. I'm speaking at a Wednesday evening service at agape International. And there was a moment of transcendence, this energy which is flowing through me, powerfully, driving home and feel very moved and very conscious that that I'm, quote, unquote, in an altered state, surreal state of coherence, and I'm driving, pulling into my driveway, and I go and getting ready to do the clicker and go into my driveway in my garage. And I have a vision. In this vision, I see Michael, is 2627 years old. He's driving to the valley. He's asking the question, What am I gonna do with my life? And I say to Michael, Michael, keep doing what you're doing. I'm here, I made it. We're good, man. Keep doing what you're doing. Don't worry about the future. You're taking the right steps. Keep listening. I'm talking to him. And so I've had the experience of being the young Michael asking, and then being Michael in the future telling him and I broke into tears. I just started crying. I'm in my driveway, just crying. I sat in my car for a long period of time, just crying about the meaning of it all. In then, right above my right side of it here. There was a me saying, there's more to come through you like that, you know? So I told Michael, it's going to be okay, keep doing what you're doing. I think if I could talk to young Michael, I'd go to that 11 year old. And when he was having that awareness, and I'd say, Hey, man, you're waking up, don't shrink for the world. Even though, don't shrink for the world. Because I got what happened was I got closer and closer to my mother, my my grandmother and my uncle. And I didn't know what to do, because what they were looking at was not who I was, I wasn't just a son, a nephew, or a grandson I was I was something else. I didn't have the words for Dale and I didn't know what it was. And I shrunk. And I acted like, you know, Michael acted like little Michael, I would tell Michael, don't do that. Don't shrink you because he shrunk a few times in life. Until Until that opening in, in college. I shrunk a few times. Don't shrink, you're okay, stay open. It's good that we tell him to stay up here. How do you define God? Love, intelligence, beauty, that's everywhere. A presence. That is not an absence does not come or go. You don't have to pray for God to come. Because the presence is omnipresent. This presence is everywhere. It's actually capital L life that's conscious of itself.
Alex Ferrari 1:07:49
And finally, what is the ultimate purpose of life?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:07:53
The ultimate purpose of us what the universal presence is up to is producing an individual that could perfectly reflect the entire cosmos as an individual. This is why we love Buddha, Jesus. Sorry, Astor. Because in their culture, and in their time, they perfectly reflected the entire cosmos, according to their particular culture, and what they curated in language at that particular time. So our purpose is to actually reveal the presence according to our uniqueness. There's no two people the same. So we get to perfectly reflect and what is that? Its love? Its beauty. Its intelligence, its order, its harmony, its abundance. So all of that. That's what the universe is up to producing an individual that can perfectly reveal that.
Alex Ferrari 1:08:42
And where can people find out more about you and the amazing work you're doing in the world, my friend?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:08:46
Tthere's a couple of ways you can go to the website, agapelive.com. That's the portal right into the spiritual community. I speak every Sunday, there are three services, meditation service into worship, celebration, fellowship, church services, you can go to my podcast, it's called Take back your mind. And it's it's F guest on there. And we have great conversations. Sometimes I do solo and just answer questions. You can go to my Instagram page, I do something there every day. I put some kind of what I think to be uplifting, educational, inspirational message. I do. I still do a few Instagram lives every Wednesday morning. A Facebook page is up. So those are the ways you can go to Michaelbeckwith.com as well go straight to it. It's being revamped right now. But it's still up and it's been curated to go to another level of greater service.
Alex Ferrari 1:09:46
And do you have any parting messages for the audience?
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:09:49
I would say to everyone listening. I would say that you are a unique emanation of life itself. off. There's nothing missing in you. You're not looking for your missing piece. The answers are within you. Do a deep dive within yourself. Find some level of spiritual practice that you're resonating with right now. And you'll discover there aren't any closed doors. In this multi dimensional universe. You'll be walking through your own perception of a door into the bounty of your own beer. Be free. Be free.
Alex Ferrari 1:10:32
My friend, thank you so much for coming on the show. It has been a pleasure and honor speaking to you today. And please continue your amazing work on the planet and up in us all awake and my friend. Thank you again!
Michael Bernard Beckwith 1:10:41
It's my joy. Thanks for the invitation.
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