Divine Encounters Episode 053 | Near-Death Experience Story
Dr. Scott Taylor says that in 1981, while he sat on a hospital window ledge holding vigil for a seven-year-old boy named Nolan, he was swept into the light alongside the boy and the boy’s mother, who had died six days earlier. In this Divine Encounters episode he tells Alex Ferrari what he says happened, how he describes it as a shared death experience, and what thirty years of exploring expanded states of consciousness have taught him about love and purpose.
Key Takeaways
- Scott says his story begins with grief: his partner Mary Fran died in a car accident in 1981, and her seven-year-old son Nolan died six days later.
- He says that as Nolan’s heart monitor went flat, he witnessed Mary Fran come across the veil and gather her son from his body.
- Scott describes being embraced by both of them and going with them into a light where “you realize instantly that the universe is love.”
- He says he had “two distinctly separate, fully functioning consciousnesses,” one in the light and one in the hospital room.
- He says that he covered his face with his hands so his joy would not disturb the grieving relatives around him.
- He believes a heart connection and a receptive, meditative state are what made the shared experience possible.
- His view of a good life is an authentic one, and he says “the ultimate purpose in life is to love.”
| Guest | Dr. Scott Taylor |
| Episode | Divine Encounters 053 |
| Year | 1981 |
| Type of experience | What Scott describes as a shared death experience, while he stayed fully present in the room |
| Where it happened | A hospital room at the Mayo Clinic in Rochester, Minnesota |
| Who he met | Mary Fran, his partner who had died six days earlier, and her son Nolan, age seven |
| What he says he found in the light | Profound love and acceptance, with no judgment |
| What came after | Years of exploring expanded states of awareness, including at the Monroe Institute |
Before: A Family Out on the Lake
Alex asks what life was like before the experience. Scott answers with a love story. In 1981, he says, he was in love with a beautiful woman named Mary Fran. She and her son Nolan, who had just turned seven, spent a day sailing on a lake in southern Minnesota.
On the way home, Scott says, Mary Fran tried to turn left onto a county road, looked into the setting sun and did not see an oncoming car. The car struck the driver’s side door and killed her instantly. Nolan had a serious head wound.
Scott shares this plainly, and we hold it with care. Nolan was taken to the Mayo Clinic in Rochester, Minnesota. Scott says he received some of the best care in the world, and that the staff did a lovely job with him.
Six Days of Vigil
Nolan took six days to make his final transition, Scott says, and he thinks that matters. Mary Fran was one of nine children. In those days, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents, cousins and friends arrived, along with Scott’s side of the family. They took over the waiting room.
They divided the time into two-hour slots so someone was always with Nolan. Scott’s slot came on the sixth day, from three to five in the morning. He sat with Mary Fran’s older sister, Jan, and they read Nolan stories and told him who was there and what was going on.
There is warmth in the way he recalls the scene. The young men in the family had gone foraging the night before and swiped cushions from every couch in the building, and people slept on floors and chairs. It was, he says, a wild mix of people trying to get comfortable while holding vigil.
Saying Goodbye
At about a quarter to five, Scott says, Jan, who was a trained nurse, checked Nolan’s chart and the monitors around his bed. She shook her head, held out her hand and said it was time.
They pulled chairs to Nolan’s head and said their goodbyes. They told him he had been a very brave young man who had fought for six days to stay with them. His body was giving out, they said. And Jan told him that if his mother should come to pick him up, it was okay to go with her. He should not feel guilty. “But if Mary Fran came, he should go.”
Then they said they loved him and left. About forty-five minutes later, a nurse woke everyone in the waiting room, and the family filed into Nolan’s room.
On the Window Ledge
Scott was at the back of the group. By the time he walked in, there were already people about four feet deep around the bed. So he sat on the window ledge next to Mary Fran’s youngest brother, Willie, and they waited.
It was, he says, a very gentle process. Nolan’s heart was slowing down and the beats were becoming less and less vibrant until the monitor flat lined.
Then, Scott says, he witnessed Mary Fran come across the veil and scoop up Nolan out of his physical body. He describes an extraordinary reunion between a mother and her child. Somehow, he says, he got to take part in it. He was still sitting on the window ledge, but he could feel the emotional exchange between the two of them.
For more on this kind of account, our glossary has an entry on shared death experiences.
Into the Light
To his surprise, Scott says, the two of them turned to him and embraced him. Then the three of them went into light.
He describes an exquisite place where you “realize instantly that the universe is love,” and where you enter profound love and acceptance. There is no judgment. Instead, he says, you realize “you are an integral part of the love of the universe.”
The three of them, Mary Fran, Nolan and Scott, had a chance to say goodbye to each other and to say how much they cared. Then they simply spent time together in that place. At some point, he says, it felt finished. The two of them turned and went further into the light, and Scott came back into his physical body.
Readers curious about the wider picture may enjoy our glossary entry on the afterlife.
Two Consciousnesses at Once
Here is the part Scott finds hardest to name. He says he was with Mary Fran and Nolan in the light and also in his physical body. He could feel Willie’s shoulder touching his. He was fully present in the room.
He says he had “two distinctly separate, fully functioning consciousnesses.” He did not have a word for it then, and it took him a long time to find one. He knows it was real for him, he says, because of what he felt: the love of the universe inside him, trying to break out.
His face, he says, showed joy, ecstasy and acceptance. It was totally inappropriate for the room. The family had just lost a nephew, a cousin and a friend, the second loss in six days. The room was full of grieving people holding each other.
So he covered his face with his hands. When his non-physical body returned to his physical body, he says, he could regain his composure, lower his hands and be with the other grieving relatives. He was fully present with them.
Why Scott Thinks It Happened
Scott says we know something about this kind of transition. There has to be a heart connection with the person who is leaving, he says, and in this case that was Nolan.
Mary Fran was a single mom, he explains. Nolan’s birth father had disavowed any knowledge of his actions and was never present in their lives, and Mary Fran had chosen not to tell Nolan who he was. When Scott came along, he and Mary Fran built a relationship, and he began to bond with Nolan. He became, he says, a surrogate dad.
When Nolan left his body, Scott says, he sent out an invitation. It was not in words. It just happened. And Scott says he had to be in a receptive state. He had been watching the heart monitor for about forty-five minutes. There is not much to do in that situation, he says. He was relaxed, in something like a meditative state, wondering when it would go silent.
Learning to Navigate Expanded States
After that night, Scott says, what he had discovered was that he had to rethink how he thought the world worked. Eventually, he says, he found the Monroe Institute, which uses binaural beats to help people focus and hold expanded states of awareness.
It gave him time in those states, he says, so he could learn how to navigate the non-physical universe. That opened every door he had ever wanted. He says he was able to touch that space again and reconnect with Mary Fran and Nolan. He also met many others who have made the transition, he says, and entities who have never been in physical form.
Our entries on consciousness and meditation offer a gentle starting point if you want to explore this territory.
What a Good Life Really Means
Alex asks about a good life, and Scott reframes the question. When he hears “good,” he says, he does not hear moral values. He hears this: “Are you living an authentic life?” Are you living the truest expression of who you are? Are you pursuing the experiences you signed up for when you came into this world?
He says we all signed up. He describes a whole center in the non-physical, a team of people who help you assemble the life you will have here. You pick your parents, your friends and the experiences you want, both physical and spiritual. A good life, he says, is consistent with that plan.
He then shares a story that reveals his worldview. One of the first people he wants to meet when he makes his final transition, he says, is Judas Iscariot. In his view, “Jesus could not be Jesus without Judas Iscariot.” Who would sign up to accept thousands of years of hate? It had to be Jesus’s best friend, Scott says, someone who loved him so dearly he would sacrifice his reputation. That was Judas’s calling, he says, and his fullest expression.
Love as the Mission
Scott says his own mission is to love, to expand his ability to love and to be there for those who want to join him. “This is a cooperative adventure,” he says, and his job is to play his part to the fullest.
For him, “the ultimate purpose in life is to love.” He adds that we gain knowledge so we can become wiser, as individuals and as a species. His personal mission, he says, is to make these states of consciousness available to people who would like to explore them.
For the wider context, see our complete guide to near-death experiences.
Questions to Sit With
- Scott says a heart connection and a receptive state made his experience possible. Who in your life shares that kind of connection with you?
- He asks whether you are living an authentic life. What is one small way you could be more fully yourself?
- If you were to see a difficult role in your own story as a calling, what might change?
This week, sit quietly for five minutes with no goal. Notice what it feels like to simply be present, the way Scott describes sitting by the monitor.
Spiritual Takeaways
- Scott says the universe is love, and that we are an integral part of it.
- He describes a bond of the heart as the doorway to a shared experience of the other side.
- He says it is possible to hold two states of awareness at once, and still be present for the people around you.
- He says a good life is an authentic one, not merely a moral one.
- He says love is the ultimate purpose, and that life is a cooperative adventure.
Please enjoy my conversation with Dr. Scott Taylor.
Guest Links: Connect With Dr. Scott Taylor
- Dr. Scott Taylor’s official website
- Scott on YouTube
- Scott’s meditation album on Spotify
- Scott on LinkedIn
Listen to the Episode
- Watch this episode ad-free on Next Level Soul TV
- Download the MP3
- More episodes: Divine Encounters
- Listen to Divine Encounters on Apple Podcasts
- Listen to Divine Encounters on Spotify
Frequently Asked Questions
Who is Dr. Scott Taylor?
Dr. Scott Taylor is the guest of this Divine Encounters episode. He describes a shared death experience in 1981 and has spent about thirty years exploring expanded states of consciousness.
What happened to Scott in 1981?
Scott says his partner Mary Fran died in a car accident and her seven-year-old son Nolan died six days later. As Nolan’s heart monitor went flat, Scott says he saw Mary Fran gather Nolan and then went with them into the light.
What is a shared death experience?
It is the term used for an experience in which a person who is not dying says they take part in the death of someone else. Scott describes his experience that way.
What did Scott experience in the light?
He says he found a place of profound love and acceptance with no judgment, where you realize the universe is love and that you are an integral part of it.
How could Scott be in two places at once?
He says he had two distinctly separate, fully functioning consciousnesses, one in the light with Mary Fran and Nolan and one sitting on a window ledge in the hospital room.
Why did Scott cover his face?
He says his face showed joy and ecstasy, which was inappropriate for a room full of grieving people, so he covered it with his hands until he came back fully into his body.
Why does Scott think it happened to him?
He says there has to be a heart connection, and that he had become a surrogate dad to Nolan. He believes Nolan sent an invitation without words, and that he himself was in a receptive, meditative state.
What is the Monroe Institute?
Scott says it is a place that uses binaural beats to help people focus and hold expanded states of awareness. He says it helped him learn to navigate the non-physical universe.
What does Scott mean by a good life?
He says it is not about moral values but about living an authentic life, the truest expression of who you are, and pursuing the experiences you signed up for.
What is Scott’s mission?
He says it is to love and expand his ability to love, and to make states of consciousness available to people who want to explore them.
Is a shared death experience proof of an afterlife?
Next Level Soul shares these experiences as lived experiences told in the person’s own words. Researchers continue to study and debate what they mean. Nothing here is medical advice or a medical claim.
Keep Exploring
- The complete guide to near-death experiences
- What a shared death experience is
- What the afterlife means across traditions
- Amber Kasic on a shared death experience with her dying father
- Janice Holden, an NDE researcher, on the evidence for life after death
- David Suich on years of NDE research
- Nancy Rynes on being shown love without dogma
- Jeffrey Olsen on losing family and being told to go back
- Browse more free masterclasses and the Divine Encounters podcast.
Follow Along with the Transcript
Alex Ferrari 0:00
Tell me what your life was like before you died.
Dr. Scott Taylor 0:08
It happened in 1981 I was in love with a beautiful woman. Her name is Mary Fran, and she and her son, Nolan, who just turned seven, had spent a day out sailing on Lake Washington, southern Minnesota, and on the way home, she attempted to make a left hand turn onto County Road, looked into the setting sun and didn't see oncoming car. That car hit her right in the driver's side door and killed Mary Fran instantly, and Nolan had a really serious head wound, and they wound up taking him to Mayo in Rochester, Minnesota. So he had some of the best care in the world, and they really did a lovely job with him. And there he took six days to make his final transition. That's important, because Mary Fran was one of nine children, and so in the intervening time between the car accident and when Nolan left his physical body for the last time, there was a chance for all of these relatives to show up. I mean, we're talking brothers and sisters and uncles and aunts, grandparents friends, other kind of cousins, family members, and that's just not her side. And we got all my side of the family was there too, and it just meant there were a lot of people that had taken over the waiting room as we waited through that final period during that six days because there were so many of us, what we did is we divvied the time up into two hour slots, and we went into and were with Nolan, and my particular slot happened to be from three in the morning till five in the morning on the sixth day after the accident, I was there with Mary Frans older sister, Jan, and the two of us spent time with Nolan. We we read him stories, we told him about who was there and what was going on. When you have that many people, it becomes really quite funny. I mean, the waiting room was just packed with people, and the evening before, the young man in the group had gone foraging or cushions that they swiped from every couch they could find in the Mayo Clinic, and brought him into the waiting room, and they were sleeping on the floors and on the chairs. It was just this wild mix of people trying to get comfortable while they were holding vigil for Nolan. Well, it got to be about 445 in the morning. About 15 minutes before the end of our shift was up, and Janny, who was a trained nurse, went down to take a look at his chart, and she was looking at his chart, and then was looking at the monitors that were surrounding his bed, and she just shook her head at me and held out her hand and said, Scott, it's time. So we grabbed a couple of chairs, we sat by Nolan's head, and we said our goodbyes, which meant that we had a chance to tell him that he had been a very brave young man and that he had been fighting for six days to stay with us all and to be with us, but it was clear that his body was giving out, and so Jae said to him that if his mother should come to pick him up. Remember, she died six days before the scene of the accident, that if Mary Fran was coming to pick him up, that it was okay for no one to go with her, and that that would be a good thing, and he shouldn't feel guilty because he had been such a brave, tenacious boy trying to stay with us, but if Mary Fran came, he should go. And we expressed our love for each other, and then we left. Got to be five o'clock Well, it wasn't more than 45 minutes later when the nurse on the floor came in and woke us all up in the waiting room, and all of these people filed into New Orleans hospital room, and that's important, because, for whatever reason, I wound up being at the tail end of this group. So when I walked in, it was already about four people feet around, surrounding the bed, as there were so many of us. And so I wound up just sitting on the window ledge next to Mary Frans youngest brother, Willie, and there we just waited. And when you're holding vigil, at least in Nolan's case, it was a very gentle process that his heart was just slowing down and the beats were becoming less and less vibrant until it just flat lined in there. Said ominous tone that and when Nolan flatlined, what I witnessed was Mary Fran coming across the veil and scooping up Nolan out of his physical body. And they had this extraordinary reunion, as you can only imagine, between a mother and child. And somehow I got to participate in that. I'm just sitting there on the window ledge, but yet I am there and feeling the emotional exchange between the two of them. And then to my surprise, what happened was then the two of them turned to me, and they embraced me, and then the three of us went to light, and once in the light, it was extraordinary. It was this exquisite place where you realize instantly that the universe is love and that you are entering into this, this place of profound love and acceptance. There's no judgment, but rather, you begin to realize that you are an integral part of the love of the universe. And then the three of us, Mary, Fran Nolan and I, had a chance to say our goodbyes, and we got to express our love for one another. We got to say how much we cared for each other, and then we had a chance just to be with one another, as in this really extraordinary place. And then at some point, it felt like it was finished. The two of them then turned and left and went further into the light, and I came back into my physical body. So what happened was that I was with Mary Fran and Nolan in the light, and yet in my physical body. And I remember I'm sitting on a window sill, and right next to me here is Willie, and we're touching shoulders, and I am also fully present in the room. So I have now this split consciousness where I am with Mary, Fran and Nolan and I am in the room. I didn't have a word for it, then it took a long time for me to find it. I call it by location that's that's as good a word as I can find. I had two distinctly separate, fully functioning consciousnesses, and I know this because I'm experiencing this incredible space, this area of love that is first witnessed by me when Nolan gets picked up by his mother, and then when I'm in the light with them, that it's like the love of the universe is inside me and it's trying to break out. And my face was this expression of joy, of ecstasy, of acceptance It was totally inappropriate for the room, and so the only thing that I could think of to do was to take and cover my face with my hands, because if anybody had looked at me, I am positive that they wouldn't have understood what was going on and that my reaction was totally inappropriate for the room, because remember, they had just lost their nephew, their cousin, their friend, whatever. And this is the second loss in six days with Mary Fran and then now Nolan. There's a room filled with grieving people that are hugging each other and looking for consolation in each other's presence, and I couldn't do that right then, so I had my hands over my face, and then when my non physical body came back to my physical body, I could regain my composure. I could take my hands down, and I could be with the other grieving relatives in the room. I was fully present in the room. We know something about that, that transition. We know that there has to be a heart connection between the individual who's going to have a shared death experience. In this case, that was Nolan and, you know, just kind of as a side note, Mary Fran was a single mom. The birth father had disavowed any knowledge of his actions, and so was never present in their lives. And so as a result, Mary Fran chose not to tell Nolan who is biological father. And so when I came along and we are developing this nice relationship. Mary Bran and I, and I'm starting to begin to bond with Nolan. I'm a surrogate dad, and as a result, we had a really special connection. And when he left his physical body, he sent out that invitation. He invited me to come along. Now it wasn't. Words. It just happened I had to be in a receptive state. And I had about 45 minutes of watching, you know, the heart monitor. There's not a lot to do there, so you're kind of relaxed. You're in a meditative state just watching this heart monitor and wondering when it's going to go silent. What I discovered was how I thought the world worked. Eventually, I found the Monroe Institute that uses binaural beats to help you focus and hold expanded states of awareness, and it allowed me the time to learn what those states of awareness are, and it gave me the time in state so that I knew how to navigate the non physical universe, and that opened up all all the doors that I ever wanted. I was able to touch that space again. Yes, I was able to reconnect with Mary Brandon Nolan and a whole bunch of other people that have made their transition, and people who've never been in the physical mine, entities of all sorts didn't, I mean, it was entirely different than something else. So when you say good, what I hear is not moralistic. I mean, there that that can be one criteria that says, you know, are you living a life that's consistent with the moral values, with the community that you're living in? My answer it's like not that we're not going that way. When I hear you say, good life, when I'm hearing you saying, Are you living an authentic life? Are you living a life that is the truest expression of who you are, and are you pursuing those kinds of experiences that you signed up for when you came into this world? Because we all do. I mean, there's a whole there's a whole center up there that talks about, when you come into this physical world, there's a whole team of people that help you assemble the life that you're going to have here. Pick your parents, your friends, and the kind of experiences you want, both physical and non physical, spiritual. They craft what your life will be like, and a good life is is consistent with coming up with those kinds of exam. Are you? Are you living the fullest expression of your life? So when I get a chance and I make my final transition and I go up to the non physical universe, one of the first people I want to meet is Judas Iscariot. Judas Iscariot to remind folks out there, he's the person who betrayed Jesus, sold him for 30 pieces of silver. Jesus could not be Jesus without Judas Iscariot, and who would sign up for that job, who would willing to accept the hate and damnations of 1000s of years and millions of people for the betrayal of the Divine Jesus, and in my world view, it had to be Jesus's best friend, because who else would do that? Only somebody that loved him so dearly that he would be willing to sacrifice not only his life but his reputation and his play bad juju that people sent it in for all those 1000s of years. But that was his calling, that was his fullest expression of himself, was to play that role so that the two of them together could make the life of Jesus be a central role in where it had to go. My mission in this life is to love, to become a further expression of what is possible, to expand my ability to love and to be there for those who want to hang out with this is a cooperative adventure, and it's my job to play my part to the fullest extent that I can. The ultimate purpose in life is to love, to expand our ability to love and to gain knowledge, so that we as human beings, as a being, a singular being, become wiser, but also for us as a collective so that we become wiser as a species. And for me, my personal mission is to make available these states of consciousness for people who would like to explore them.
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