Can Humanity Avoid This? Remote Viewing the Past & Future with Stephan Schwartz

Scientist, futurist, award-winning author of both fiction and nonfiction Stephan A. Schwartz is a Distinguished Associated Scholar of the California Institute for Human Science, Distinguished Consulting Faculty Saybrook, University, and a BIAL Foundation Fellow. He is a columnist for the journal Explore, and editor of the daily web publication Schwartzreport.net in both of which he covers trends that are affecting the future.

For over 40 years, as an experimentalist, he has been studying the nature of consciousness. In addition to his non-fiction books and novels, he is the author of more than 250 technical reports, papers, academic book chapters, prefaces, and introductions, His work has been covered worldwide by numerous magazines, newspapers, and television productions, and he is the recipient of the Parapsychological Association Outstanding Contribution Award, the U.S. Navy’s Certificate of Commendation, OOOM Magazine’s (Germany) 100 Most Inspiring People in the World Award, and the 2018 Albert Nelson Marquis Award for Outstanding Contributions.

Please enjoy my conversation with Stephan Schwartz.

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Follow Along with the Transcript – Episode 157

Stephan Schwartz 0:00
But basically what they're describing is a world in which people don't travel as much air airplanes particularly there as rail has come back more powerfully the end of the internal combustion engine and what I find particularly interesting is they describe you know the way we are going at the evey movement. Electric Vehicle movement is recreating the gas station model. That is charging stations. But the remote viewers about the future describe their roads charge the cars.

Alex Ferrari 0:59
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I'd like to welcome to the show Stephan Schwartz. How you doin Stephan?

Stephan Schwartz 1:37
I'm doing right well.

Alex Ferrari 1:39
Thank you so much for coming on the show. I'm fascinated with your work, the research you've done over the years, the books you've written, and I've never had anybody on the show, specifically talking about remote viewing before and you are the expert in and you've done so much with it in, in the in the terms of your life. Can you tell me first first question What made you get interested in this kind of research in this kind of work?

Stephan Schwartz 2:06
Well, I woke up when I was 24. Okay. Through a set of synchronicities. I was. I had been working for National Geographic, I got drafted. And I came out I went to New York was a screenwriter was working for a company there was doing a movie and through a series of very odd events, I got introduced to the Edgar Cayce material. And I decided when I was first taken there, I just randomly pulled off the shelf, one of his readings in these little green notebooks. And it was a reading given in 1936 for a woman that said she had been a member of the iseen community at Khirbet, Qumran and a teacher of astrology. And Alex, I can tell you that you're your hair can stand on end. Because the last thing that I had done for geographic before I went into the service was research on the Dead Sea Scrolls. So I was pretty knowledgeable about the Dead Sea Scrolls and I knew in 1936 First of all, nobody knew that there wasn't a scene community at Khirbet, Qumran. Second of all, nobody knew that women were a part of it. And third of all, no one knew that they were interested in astrology. So I sort of read this and thought to myself, where in the world did this guy get this information? How could he know this? 11 years before Darwin, tribes boy, was chucking a rock in a cave and heard something go clunk. And went down and found what we know today is the Dead Sea Scrolls. And the excavations that were that done subsequently revealed that women were part of the community. And the scrolls themselves are obsessed with astrology. So how could he possibly have known that 11 years before anybody else in the world knew that? Where did he get that information? And that really led me to start what has become my life's work in a way which is the study of consciousness. And I decided that I would study the readings and I would read them all and I would start at the first one and go all the way to the end. Far as I know, I'm the only one Carson's ever done that, except for Gladys Davis, the woman who took down or was the archivist. And in 1968, that was in 1965. And then in 1968, because Casey kept saying, Well, other people could do this. I thought, well, let's see if that's true. So I built in my back garden, in Virginia Beach, I built a grid out of rope on the ground. And I would bury mason jars with things in them, or 35 millimeter film canisters with things in them. And I would make a mimeograph. That's how old we're talking about of this grid and send it out to people all over the world and say to them, in one of these squares, I started out with 12 and eventually became 144 squares. In one of these squares, I have buried something, can you locate it? And if you can locate it, would you please mark it on the mimeograph sheet I sent you? And then would you please describe for me what is buried there. So first location, then description, and I discovered people could do it.

Alex Ferrari 6:23
So what exactly is remote viewing?

Stephan Schwartz 6:27
Remote viewing is accessing non local consciousness to acquire non locally sourced information.

Alex Ferrari 6:35
So is that I mean, I'm, I'm very familiar with Edgar Casey's work and, and it for everybody listening. Can you explain just a quick bite on who advocating was?

Stephan Schwartz 6:45
Well, in your case, he was a man in Kentucky was born in post Civil War, Kentucky. He was a family were of angelical fundamentalists. He never got past the eighth grade. He trained to become a photographer. And then he lost his voice. And he went to a kind of not conference but a meeting with a hypnotist who was holding it. And he volunteered to be the subject and began to tell the hypnotist what he needed to do to get his voice back. And he did. And so, he began in the late 19th century, he died in 1946, I think 4546 He gave about 15,000 readings, he would go into a trance state. And then he said, he contacted his higher self, what religion would call the soul, what I would call the eternal self, this is the aspect of consciousness that is not in physical space time. Part of the issue is the idea of the continuity of consciousness, that is you existed prior to incarnating. Your you had an eternal self that existed and it manifested a personality which incarnated and you had life and then upon your physical death, that personality, information architecture, became part of the eternal cells, information architecture. And, and then, after a period of time for reasons that are particular to you, you chose to manifest another personality and physically incarnated. So all of the research, the near death research, for instance, is there about over 13 million people in the United States have had a near death experience. The mediumship people channeling supposedly dead people. There were remote viewing research, the reincarnation research, all of that research is about studying the non local aspect of consciousness.

Alex Ferrari 9:42
Can you can you explain what non local aspect of consciousness is exactly?

Stephan Schwartz 9:48
Well, I cannot tell you what consciousness is nor can anybody else right. But what I can tell you is it seems very clear from the research and I need to emphasize with you Alex that I am a data person I'm not interested in I'm not a philosopher, I'm not a theoretician, I Don't speculate. What I care about is objectively verifiable, hard data. So I'm an experimentalist. And if you look at the experimental data of in those wide range of fields, what you discover is that the evidence that there is an aspect of consciousness that is not physiologically based, is simply irrefutable. I mean, materialism, which arose as a result of the Council of Trent in the 1500s, which split consciousness from science. And materialism became the dominant paradigm, the idea that consciousness is entirely grounded in your brain, dead meat, no brain, no consciousness. That's just not true. I mean, just on the basis of the evidence, it's not true. And that instead, what we're talking about is there is an aspect of consciousness that is not physiologically based, that it is that is, it is not dependent on your brain. Your brain has a role in letting non local consciousness data become conscious in space time. But that consciousness is not, does not exist, solely because you have a brain. And so I began doing this research with the grid. I originally called a distant viewing because the people that I was getting to do it were scattered all over the world that just people I knew the word remote viewing, which is, by the way, a terrible term was coined by one of the remote viewers named Ingo Swann. It's, as I say, a terrible term because it has nothing to do with viewing and remote. This is not the issue.

Alex Ferrari 12:08
So So can you explain to me the actual process? So when you send somebody, you know, into research, let's say you send me this thing, do I get into a meditative state? Do I just take a guess? How does what's the process?

Stephan Schwartz 12:21
Well, actually, I'm glad you brought meditation up because the key to the whole business is the ability to attain and sustain intention focused awareness. People have been doing remote viewing, I mean, what we would call today remote viewing for 1000s of years. The oldest recorded remote viewing we have, and it was done essentially exactly as we would do it today, is in the 46th Chapter of Heraclitus is he was the founder of history, a bit recording history. Herodotus is histories of the world. And it involves crisis, the king of the Lydians. You know, we know as riches crisis, because he coined money. He was the first person to coin money, and he thought he was going to be attacked by the Persians in what is now Iran. And they were big and he was relatively small, Lydia was a smaller kingdom. And so he was very concerned, what should he do? And he appointed a group of friends, staff to go out to the seventh Oracle's of the Greek world, there were seven Oracle's of individuals who basically did remote viewing. The only one we know about is the Oracle of Delphi, which was these were young girls. pithiness, as they were called, who would sit in a kind of tripod over a crack in the earth and hydrocarbons would bubble up which caused altered states of consciousness. Anyway, so he told these teams he sent out to the seventh Oracle's he said wait for the 100th day and on the 100th day and not before you go into the Oracle and you ask the Oracle what is creases son evaluate is doing? what today we would call an outbound remote viewing. And so the only one we know is the Oracle of Delphi because it was the correct one. And when he when the team in Delphi, which was quite a distance away, went into the temple with the pithiness Before they even ask the question, she said, Well, I can I can count the Sands of Time. That is the 100 days. And I see the great see that is they had to come by ship to get there. And I see a great earn bronze urn and a great bronze lid and a tortoise and a hare being cut up and thrown into the pot of boiling water. That didn't make any sense to them at all, of course. And but they wrote it all down, as they were told to do. And they went back to two creases. And what they of course, had not known was that creases on the 100th day thought, what can I do that no one would think a king would be doing. Because if they said, Well, he's sitting on his throne, issuing Enix Well, I mean, that's a king, what? Course. So he had a tripod brought into his courtyard of his palace, and a fire built and a big bronzer and brought in a hunk from the tripod with a bronze lid. And he cut up a tortoise and a hare and threw it into the pot of water. And so when the Delphi team came back, and the embassy ends and told him what the Oracle of Delphi had said, while he bowed down and gave a BCS because that was exactly right. And that it was recorded by Herodotus, who, as I say, is considered the father of recorded history. And he wrote it in the 46 chapter. That's exactly a remote viewing, they call it that of course. So I would call I would actually call all of this non local perception.

Alex Ferrari 16:54
So let me ask you is this does remote viewing have anything to do with the Akashic records and connecting to those records?

Stephan Schwartz 17:03
What Casey called the Akashic records, I would call the non local information architecture, it is the two great questions for which I cannot answer. I cannot give you an answer, and nor can anybody else, by the way, are what is consciousness? And what is information? Now, there are lots of people that will tell you what information is in space time. But we know from for instance, the reincarnation research, that thing people bring things across lives. And so where is that information? We know that mediums provide information about the location or description of things that no one in the world knows at the time that they do it. And they they, they go to the place or whatever, and check and it's there. Where is that information? Or in the case of the work that I did? Or that I do, which is I started out doing an archaeology because it was pure, triple blind. Everybody agreed they didn't know the answer. So if I could get a remote viewer to describe the location, just like the grid, and then describe what I was going to find. The question was, where did they get that information? Where was it?

Where is it stored?

Yeah, well stored is perhaps not that's a physical term. Sure. But in any case, what we know is that there is this aspect of consciousness, which is independent of physiology. We know that you can get access to it. That we know that from there, this is again, all from research. We know that, like all other human skills, it's kind of bell curve. That is there's a few people who are really, really gifted at that like Edgar Casey, or a Stefanos of yet ski or, you know, people like that. So there's a few people that are really gifted at it, just like there are a few people that are really gifted at playing the violin or, or doing physics. There's a few people who just can't seem to get it. And most people fall somewhere in between. About 11% of the population are really good at it. But in any case, what we discover from the research again, is that meditators do better than non meditators routinely. And that's why they teach meditation in martial art dojos Tibetan lama sarees Hindu temples, you know, all over the world. If you look at all the world's religions, You will see that they all have some technique for developing meditation. And the reason they do that is that being able to go into meditation allows you to focus your consciousness, so that the neurophysiological stimulus that dominates most of your thinking, it's hot, it's cold, it's light, it's dark, it's smelly, it smells good, whatever. Most of our thinking is tied up with sensory impressions. Oh, I saw this woman and she was a beautiful woman, you know, all that kind of stuff? Well, what you want is that to slide into the background, so that you can become aware of what in religion, they call the still small voice, but I would call the non local aspect of consciousness, you open to non local awareness. And, and you're able to get any kind of information you want. I mean, that's part of what freaks people out is that there are no secrets.

Alex Ferrari 21:07
Okay, so you mentioned something in regards to archaeology, which I found really interesting. What you did some amazing work in archaeology you help find or can you explain to me what kind of work you did in the archives and the art.

Stephan Schwartz 21:20
The reason I got interested in archaeology is a come out of anthropological background. And at the time that I began, which is, in the late 60s, one of the big issues in archaeology was where to look, because most archaeological finds were done, are occurred, serendipitously, you know, Farmer was plowing a field and found a tomb or a road crew was digging an underpass and came across a temple or whatever. So most of this was done serendipitously. And the big issue that they were talking about at that time in archaeology was how do we know better where to look? So I thought, well, that's very attractive. And I, as I told you, I had been doing this grid experiment in my back garden, successfully. And I thought, Well, okay, maybe I can use this to viewing remote viewing, non local perception, whatever. I can use it to locate archaeological sites. Just like the grid, I'd get him to locate it on the map, make me a little drawing on a map. And then give me a description of what I'll find that's there. And then we'll go do the field work. And before we do the field work we'll have I designed the protocol so that there would be an electronic survey of the same area that remote viewers and pick to see whether an electronic sensing device like of sidescan, sonar, proton, proton precession, magnetometer, ground penetrating radar, and whatever, whether you could find this same site electronically. And in all instances, you could not. So that that and then the second thing was, once we've done the electronic survey, then we go do the field work. And it's not a search technique, we just go exactly to the place that they draw. And if it's underwater, I give i We go out in a little boat, or a big boat, and I give him a bully. And I say, when we get over the site, drop the buoy. Or if it's on land, I say, here's a wooden stake when we get to the place, just put the stake in the ground, you can go to my website, Stephanie schwartz.com. And see a couple of movies, I make movies of these things. You can watch a guy locate a buried building in a buried city, out of 1200 square kilometers in the middle of the desert. And describe and describe objects down to five sixteenths of an inch.

Alex Ferrari 24:14
That's remarkable. So when you're remote viewing, you're sitting there, basically in a meditative state, and you have an intention of what you're looking for. And that information kind of is downloaded into your into your mind essentially,

Stephan Schwartz 24:27
Yes, basically, it's like doing a Google search.

Alex Ferrari 24:31
It's a Google search of, but the internet is much larger where your Google searching?

Stephan Schwartz 24:37
Yeah, it's the non local Google

Alex Ferrari 24:40
Is the non local. So it's the cloud, if you will.

Stephan Schwartz 24:43
Well, again, I don't know what information is and it clearly exists outside of space time. So I don't know how to describe it exactly. But what is clear from the experimental research is that every thing that ever happened, right is part of the great non-local Google information database,

Alex Ferrari 25:08
Which is what the Hindus were talking about 6000 years ago with the Akashic Record.

Stephan Schwartz 25:13
That's what they mean by the Akashic Record. Exactly,

Alex Ferrari 25:16
Exactly. And then Edgar Edgar Cayce. He kind of brought that back into, into popular understanding. And he was doing his work. It this is absolutely fascinating. You can train people anybody to do this, correct?

Stephan Schwartz 25:30
Yeah, I've tested 23,000 People

Alex Ferrari 25:34
And the majority of them are able to do it at different levels.

Stephan Schwartz 25:38
As I've said, some people are much better than other people like, well, example, George McMullen. A guy with an eighth grade education who was a parts manager at a Chrysler dealership up in Nanaimo, Canada and British Columbia, who was demonstrated over and over again. I mean, we found Cleopatra's Palace, we found Marc Anthony's Palace, we found the lighthouse of pharaohs, one of the Seven Wonders of the Ancient World. We found buried ships, we found one of Columbus's caravan shells from his fourth voyage, I mean, on and on, and on and on. And here's this guy with an eighth grade education in a small town up on Vancouver Island. Who could do this? He could locate things on a map, or Hala Hamad, who was a woman who was internationally known as a fine arts photographer, who was originally brought in by Russell Targ, another researcher to be a control because he didn't think she was any good at it. And she didn't think she was any good at it. And she turned out to be fantastic at it.

Alex Ferrari 26:45
And what did what are the the archaeology, archaeological Estelle establishment have to say this word?

Stephan Schwartz 26:53
Well, in one case, it for instance, I wanted to this is in the Alexandria project, I wrote a book about it the Alexandria project, you can get it off Amazon. I wanted to dive in the eastern harbor of Alexandria, Alexandria is the second largest city in Egypt. It's right up on the Mediterranean literal. And the remote viewers had told me Cleopatra's palace and Mark Anthony's palace, and the lighthouse of pharaohs, and Pompey's pillar, which were known things to have existed, but nobody knew where they were. They were all underwater, because the the tectonic plate had had shifted and sunk. And the ancient city of Alexandria had extended about 30 feet further out into the sea than it did at that modern time. And nobody knew this, of course, any of this. And I wanted to do this diving. And so I went to the Government of Egypt, in the person of the governor of Egypt, Mahatma Hamid Hilmi, and head of the archeology division in government in Cairo. To ask permission to do this dive in, nobody had done it. And the archaeologists at the University of Alexandria, the we've had the big archaeology department, they just thought the whole thing was crap. And said, you know, that's nonsense. You can't do that. Nobody can do that. That's just crap. I mean, they were a little more polite than that. But actually, we can. Fowler. Yeah. Anyway, so Governor Hilmi said to me, you know, they don't want you to do it. And I said, Well, you know, what would it take to get you to say, yes. And he said to these archaeologists, what would it get you to say yes. And they said, well, you'd have to prove to us you could do it. I said, Okay. So they said, Well, I said, Well, what do you want me to do? And they said, We want you to locate a buried building of our choice in a buried city out in the desert, about 40 kilometers from Alexandria. I said okay. And so we went out there early one morning I took Georgia and Hela. There were no maps, so I couldn't do the map part. There was no map of the right scale to be able to do it. So it was you know, we took them out one at a time. One stayed back in one I went in the car with me. We drove out in literally out into the desert. You can see it as I say, you can watch everything I'm telling you it's it's all on the movie on my website. And this archaeologist says to George, I want you to locate a buried building in the buried city of Maria, and I want you to locate a building that has tiles or mosaics. And I want you to tell me exactly where it is and what I'm going to find. Because he was going to do the dig not me.

Alex Ferrari 30:21
So they haven't. They don't they haven't found this. They don't know where it goes. They don't know where it is. They know it exists possibly in this giant area.

Stephan Schwartz 30:29
Yes, in this area buried under the under the sand dunes. Got it. So we walk around for a couple of hours. And finally George says, Okay, I know where I want to go. And he kneels down in the sand. And he says to this archaeologist, this where I want to go and this and the guy says, Okay, so we get in the car, and we drive. George says, go left, go, right. And the archaeologist and all his graduate students are in another car. They're all snickering away. And we get to this place that George says, okay, stop here. And he gets out. And they get out and they're following behind us. And it's all being filmed. And George walks along for a little while, and he says, Okay, I'm walking over a wall. That's the building we're looking for. And I said, you're walking over a wall? And he says, yeah, there's a wall. And then there's this three rooms. And it's about three to four feet down. That's it. It's just like three or four feet. That was it down under the ground, right. So it's not that it's not like, hard to get to. No, no, no, no. And, and he says, this is a Christian building. It was built by Christians. And you could just hear him giggling and laughing away, there. And he says, and there are these little tiles there. They're white, red and black. And they're smooth on one that's polished on one side, and they have all kinds of white plaster on the other side. And he draws a little picture of it. And so I go over to the archaeologist, and he says, Boy, are you in for a big embarrassment? I said, why? And he said, Well, we did a electronic survey of this exact area. It was published. It's a part of the published academic record ever done by the University of Guelph, and they had ground penetrating radar, and there's nothing at the place that you pick. And even if there was anything, it couldn't possibly be Christian. It would have to be Roman. And I don't believe word of it. So we brought hella in and Hellas goes. Same thing, same place. She says, oh, yeah, there's three rooms. And then in the middle room, there's some kind of a clay column that was built much later. And it has something to do with eat. I don't exactly understand, but it's a it's clay column in the middle room. So she goes away, we bring George back. I say, George, here's four steaks, can you stake out the corners of the road? Now think about this. stake out the corn, not the roof of the building. Right? Corners are very important. Because if you dug down and you didn't and there was no floor and you didn't get the walls, you would never know the building was there. So you have to get the corners, right. So we he says okay, and he puts in stakes and and then I say to the archaeologists a guy named Fousey, Fokker Ronnie, okay, you get your guys in start digging. And he said, well not gonna find anything you know. I mean, it is all a waste of time. And we start digging and at three feet a few inches we find the top of the walls. They are George out of I think it was 1700 square kilometers, has located a building down to his his. He's 28 inches off. And we keep digging. When we get to the middle room. We find the big clay column that Hela had described. It turns out it was a kind of Bedouin oven that was built after the city had been abandoned. The Bedouin tribes people had moved in and they had built up to bake bread on it. They'd build a fire around the clay and get very hot, then they'd slap you know, flour to make bread, and the heat of the of the column would cook the bread, but it was exactly as she described it.

Alex Ferrari 34:59
So what Did they say?

Stephan Schwartz 35:02
Well doing Okay, great. And we get down a little further. And we find the tiles red, white and black. And we get a little further and we find the Christian concentrate a consecration marks on the foundation. So it is a Christian building, not a Roman building, or Egyptian, you know, it was it had the tiles exactly as described, the rooms were exactly as described, they were exactly where they were placed. So it all worked. So we went, I went back to Governor Hillman and said, Okay, now what he said, Now you have permission to go dive. And that's how we found Cleopatra's palace and Mark Anthony's palace and Pompey's pillar and the lighthouse Ferris,

Alex Ferrari 35:53
And I'm assuming at this point, the establishment of archaeology and the archaeological establishment, I'm assuming start to take you more seriously at this point?

Stephan Schwartz 36:02
Oh, well, they were very happy for all the discoveries. And in a way, the way the most important thing we found was that we found the ancient seawall exactly is where the remote viewers had put it. And that revealed that the entire construct that they had built up about how the city was laid out was wrong, because the city extended 30 further feet out into the sea than it does today.

Alex Ferrari 36:29
So so the big question is, where is Atlantis Sir? Atlantis.

Stephan Schwartz 36:38
Oh, well, that I think is one of the areas where Edgar Cayce he was wrong. Oh, interesting. Interesting. Are there are two areas of the Edgar Cayce readings that I believe are incorrect. One is the Atlantis stuff. And the other is the Egyptian rod top stuff. And the reason is that we know from the experimental research, that the intention and beliefs of the questioner influenced very strongly the remote viewer, and so people that asked him his questions about Atlantis, were all Atlantis fanatics. Right. And so he, he describes this civilization that supposedly existed 10,500 years ago, that built the pyramids. That's not true. We know who built the pyramids. I mean, we literally know the guy that was the architect of it, we know where he's buried. There is no evidence for a high civilization that was able to fly, for instance, as he describes 10,500 years ago. Got it. And the reason I said is that the people who asked the questions were fanatics, and they influenced, as you do. So the researchers intentions, and attitudes have an effect on the ability of the remote viewer to get information because in the non local, in the great Google in the sky, as it were inaccurate information is part of that strongly believed is part of the information architecture. Fair enough.

Alex Ferrari 38:36
Okay, fair enough. Now, another thing that you that you are talking about in other interviews is being able to remote view the future, the 2040s and 2050s. And now, even the 2060s. Can you talk a little bit about what that process is? Because we've been talking about finding things based on current information or, you know, finding something here locally now, but we haven't talked about the future or, you know, remote viewing the future. What is the process to remote view the future and what are let's go decade by decade, what did you find out about the 2040s?

Stephan Schwartz 39:18
Much more than one interview.

Alex Ferrari 39:21
Well, let's, let's get let's do.

Stephan Schwartz 39:25
I'll give you a sort of overview of it. Yeah, I appreciate it. All right. So I I am working in government. I'm the Special Assistant to the Chief of Naval Operations for research and analysis. I'm also working over with the National Security Council. And I'm on the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Secretary of Defense discussion group on innovation technology in the future, and on the Smithsonian discussion group. Upon innovation technology in the future, so I'm part of the geopolitical world. And this is 1976 When I left government. And at that time, most people who were in that world thought we were going to have a nuclear war, either by accident, or design. And in fact, were it not for one Soviet colonel who wouldn't push the button, we would have had a third world war. Right. So in any case, I, you know, I had a young daughter, who had just been born was a few years old. And I was very concerned about what her life would be like, if we had a nuclear war. So I thought, Well, okay, I will, I'll see if people can remote view the future. We knew that there. We'd like to do pre cognitive, remote viewings of a few days, or even weeks and in future, but could you go further into the future and get successful information? We expect to see when you do these big projects, not just describe a target, you know, I'm going to show you a target, would you describe it, that's a kind of standard laboratory protocol. And I've done 1000s of those. But this is a much bigger deal. You're looking at much bigger things going on than describing a radar station in a photograph. I began I didn't want I knew from doing research, that if you get too far into the future, you don't understand what they're saying. For instance, I'll give you an example. Jules Verne, who wrote 20,000 leagues under the sea. Wrote a second was very successful, a hugely successful book. This is in the 1850s. He wrote a second book was about Paris in the 1960s. And in that, he says, corporations dominate the economy. In Paris. Women work in corporations, unheard of people drive around in internal combustion engines. And business correspondence is transmitted by facsimile machines. And the city of Paris is defined by a huge metal tower. Wow. Which didn't exist at the time. And he sends this to his publisher. And his publishers writes him back and says, Jewell, I'm your friend, as well as your editor. And the best thing I can tell you to do is to put this away and don't talk about it. Because it'll make you sound like a crazy person. Nobody would believe any of this. None of this is ever going to happen. How can you possibly think that women are going to become part of corporations? Or I don't have any idea what a facsimile machine is? But anyway, this whole thing is nonsense. Just put it away and forget about it, which is what he does. And in the 19 I guess 1980s Maybe I may have that date, not right. Published in 91. Anyway, I think I think 1980s an air of Jules ferns inherits a farm that was his. And he goes up to this property that he has inherited. And he goes into a barn and under the barn, he sees a little safe. And he says to the farmer, what's in the safe? And the guy says, I've no idea. You can't open it. I couldn't open it. My father couldn't open it. So I've no idea what's in the safe. So he gets up locksmith to come up. And he gets the open and in the safe is this correspondence I've just described, and the Manuscript of the Book. And of course, everything that Jules Verne described was correct. He had looked viewed the future. Write a pretty far ahead. Yes. And he was so far ahead that nobody could understand what he was talking about. So when I was starting to do through this, I thought, well, I can't go too far in the future. Because if I go too far, I won't understand what they're talking about. Right? So I thought, well, I'll go to 2050. So in 1978, I began, what has become now a 20, some year experiment. I got 4000 people scattered all over the world, many different countries, to remote view, the same date in the year 2050. So, what today is the ninth of November? So if we were doing this, I would say to you, Alex, I want you to go forward in time, to the ninth of November, in the year 2050, or, ultimately 2060. And are you incarnate? Well, if you're not see it through somebody else's eyes, and describe for me, you know, what do you see? How do people live? What's, what's medicine like it? But the big question that I started with, because I was concerned about the war, was, has there been a nuclear war? And they said, No. And I said, well, then the world must be safer. And they said, No, the world is much more dangerous. And I said, really why? I couldn't imagine. They said, because of terrorism. Now, in 1978, when I started this, the only terrorism was the Protestant Catholic fight going on in Ireland that you know, anybody was paying attention to?

Alex Ferrari 46:43
That was before the Iran. Yeah, yeah. Before any of that stuff happened.

Stephan Schwartz 46:48
Yeah. So I just didn't know what to make of that. And I said to them, well, what's the Soviet Union like now? And they say, well, it doesn't exist. I said, what do you what do you mean, it doesn't exist? They said, it doesn't exist. And I went around to friends of mine in the geopolitical world. And said to him, I've got this information that says that by 2050, the Soviet Union doesn't exist. I went to them and said, you know, can you think of any reason why the Soviet Union wouldn't exist? I mean, think about it. We were at that time, the whole geopolitical structure was the two great superpowers, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, you know? And they said, to me, that's just nonsense. What are you talking about that, of course, the Soviet Union isn't going to disappear. We, you know, space aliens are going to come down and rip it up and take it away. That is nonsense. But of course, Christmas Day 1991, Soviet Union cease to exist. And I said to him, Well, I let's talk about health care. And they said, you know, what's it like? And they describe a very different kind of health care. And I said, Well, are people then healthier? And they said, well, except there's going to be a series of pandemics. And I said, really? And they said, Yes, the first one will be a blood disease, which crosses over from primates to humans in Africa. And it's going to kill millions of people. And I went to a friend of mine, and this is 7879. And I went to a friend of mine, who was the Deputy Director of the National Institutes of Health, and said to him, do you have any idea what about a blood disease that crosses over from primates to humans in Africa, and that could kill millions of people? And he said to me, Stephen, whatever it is, you're smoking quit.

Alex Ferrari 48:56
That wasn't that far ahead. That wasn't that far ahead.

Stephan Schwartz 48:59
No, 1981 we get HIV AIDS kills 35 million people, then we get czars, then we get h five n one. And now we have COVID. And we're going to have more. Because the viruses and bacteria are mutating as a result of climate change to accommodate to new circumstances. But in any case, that's what they told me at the time. Nobody believed me. The other thing that they started telling me I was my lab at that time was in Los Angeles. And I was doing a session with someone the first time and I said, Well, you know, there we go forward in time to 2050 Where are you? I'm in Los Angeles. I said, Okay, what's Los Angeles like? And they said, well, well, it's very different. I said, why? They said, well, All For starters, so a lot of Santa Monica and Venice is underwater. And Hermosa Beach, Manhattan Beach. It's all underwater. And I went to a friend of mine who was one of the climatologist leading climatologist in the government and said, Can you tell me any reason why the water would flood over Los Angeles or most of beach or Manhattan Beach? And? And he said, No, there is no reason that's just nonsense. But of course, climate change is now, if you look at the projections is now doing exactly that. I was in Florida, and I got some people to do remote viewing of 2050. And they said, well, most of the Florida is gone. I said what they said, Oh, well, from Fort Myers down. It's all gone. And I thought, really, and I went to a friend, who had another friend who was in government in Florida and said, Do you know any reason? Well, yeah, of course. And they just said, Come on,

Alex Ferrari 51:24
I hear a theme. There's a theme here going. Yeah.

Stephan Schwartz 51:28
Exactly. So climate change all this stuff about climate change. I've never heard of climate change, until 1991, when I read a paper in the American scientist about Ice Coring, which suggested that there had been climate change, and that climate change was beginning to occur. And now of course, I mean, you know, we everybody, almost every day, but at the time, 1970 770-879-8081 8283 84, nobody knew what to make of that. The other thing was that, I mean, there's so many things like that. They said to me. I said, Well, you know, what is society like now? And they said, well, it's being driven by by these electronic programs. And I said, electronic programs, how are they doing it? This was before the internet really took off. And and I've forgotten. Netscape started in

Alex Ferrari 52:46
90.

Stephan Schwartz 52:48
Yeah, some somewhere in their

Alex Ferrari 52:52
Early 90s.

Stephan Schwartz 52:53
So in 1978 79, you know, I bought my first computer in 1978. Apple two was 64 kilobits of memory. And these people are talking about all Well, no, no, you can talk to anybody all anywhere in the world. And that's the way people communicate. And, and of course, there's none of that made any sense. But of course, now, it's, you know,

Alex Ferrari 53:22
Makes perfect sense. So that's what they're saying. That's in 2050.

Stephan Schwartz 53:26
That was 2050, you know, the 2060s. So the 2060s, which is the data that I'm now analyzing? The big thing about the 2060s, it really stands out for me is that between 2040 and 2045, there's going to be a really seismic, cataclysmic change in human society. And I'm not quite sure why yet, I think it's actually a confluence of events, climate change, the end of the internal combustion machine engine. The shift as a result of climate change, they're going to be big migrations in the United States, away from the coasts because of too much water out of the Southwest because there's not enough water and the temperature is too high, and out of the Central States because of cataclysmic weather events like tornadoes. So they're going to be these three big migrations, and they're going to radically change society, the society, the 20 2060s, talk about this 2040 2045 event. I don't as I say, it's, I don't think it's a single event. I think it's a confluence of things. But in any case, they described themselves as being on the other side of it. So by 2016 Eat whatever it is that happens, people have begun to accommodate for it. They describe where they live very differently. It's much more minimalist. It reminds me more of Scandinavia, maybe or Holland, the Netherlands.

Alex Ferrari 55:21
And this is your speaking of the US.

Stephan Schwartz 55:24
The US Yes. Okay. I asked you if the United States still exists, because I wasn't sure that it would exist. And they said, well, it still exists in form. But real power has moved down to the states and groups of states. And you can see it happening. You can see the secession movement is growing up amongst the right wing. And then also you see a growing chain change in consciousness in blue states, who are tired of the stupidity of the red states, and their unwillingness to deal with climate change. So I think Washington, Oregon and California, are going to become a group.

Alex Ferrari 56:15
Right, Texas,

Stephan Schwartz 56:16
If you look at the research data, you can see that I mean, this sounds very partisan and political. It's not. That's not the way to think of it. It's just data. If you look at governance, across the United States, what you see is that Republican governance is always inferior to democratic governance, if your calibration is social well being, which is what I care about. Because in my understanding, now of all of this research I've been doing, about 20 years ago, I started looking at if, if we can do this in a laboratory with a single person or a group of people, how does that play out socially? So I wrote a book called The eight laws of change, after about 20 years of research, about how do you really create social transformation that that focuses on well being. And the 2060s Describe a world which is very different, largely, I think, because in the present day, the United States is really a country that has only one social priority, and that's profit. Everything is driven by profit, not wellbeing. And that you can see, again, in those states, where wellbeing does play a role, that they do better than states where that doesn't take place. Red states, for every dollar they put into the treasury in taxes, they take out more than $1, blue states put an F for every dollar they put in, they take out less than $1. So I think the red state, the blue states are going to get tired of financing the failure of the red states. There's going to be these big migrations, which are radically going to alter healthcare. Because dealing with the kind of internal migrations, you know, I spoke at a medical conference. And I said to these doctors, who were asking me about this, I said, if you lived in a town of say 50,000 people, and 5000 people suddenly showed up in your town who were immigrants, internal migrants, where would you house them? Where would they go to the bathroom? What kind of health care 11% of whatever are diabetics? Would you have the insulin to take care of them? And they said, No, we wouldn't be prepared for any of that. But that's what they are describing is these migrations, these changes, moving out of cities, smaller communities, this big event between 2040 2045 which changes society fundamentally

Alex Ferrari 59:21
Around the world, not just in the United States,

Stephan Schwartz 59:23
Not just in the United States, but around the world, but particularly in the United States.

Alex Ferrari 59:29
Is there is there a superpower in 2060?

Stephan Schwartz 59:33
Not in the way that we have thought about it in the traditional, you know, bipolar world, China has become a much bigger force. The United States less

Alex Ferrari 59:51
Is there. Is there any wars between now and then I have to remember many.

Stephan Schwartz 59:58
Well, there are a lot alkalize wars like the Ukrainian war, but not World Wars? I don't see I don't get any descriptions about World Wars.

Alex Ferrari 1:00:09
It may ask you a question because there's so many. There's such a shift right now in consciousness. Throughout the world, more people are awakening more people are connecting spiritually that more people are meditating, more people are doing yoga, more people are just trying to connect to source more than ever before. How is that evolution showing up in 2050 2060? As far as just the consciousness of humanity?

Stephan Schwartz 1:00:36
Well, people are, it's, it's a question of priorities and values. The 2050 and 2060 people describe, particularly the 2060s. The 2050s, I think, and I'm going back, I'm just beginning to look at this. I think the 2050s are still kind of in shell shock for whatever happened between 2014 and 2045. And 10 years later, the 2060s. That's they are describing a world which in which they talk about this as in the past. So I, but basically, what they're describing is a world in which people don't travel as much. As airplanes particularly, there is a rail has come back more powerfully the end of the internal combustion engine. And what I find particularly interesting is they describe, you know, the way we are going at the evey movement, electric vehicle movement is recreating the gas station model. That is charging stations. But the remote viewers about the future describe that the roads charge the cars. And there is in fact research going on it at Cornell that the roads charge the thing, which changes the whole battery issue. And I think that's probably what's going to happen. That's what they're predicting. And I think that's probably what's going to happen.

Alex Ferrari 1:02:29
It's just an infrastructure situation where the technology is existing. Now I've seen detector that technology, it's, it is doable, but it's just infrastructure. It's it's the same problem that we've had from the beginning is breaking down the old systems that are not serving us anymore, like the like the combustion engine, and, and change moving the ship moving the political gears moving the financial gears to make it all make sense. We all can do it if we want to. It's just

Stephan Schwartz 1:03:00
A question of priorities.

Alex Ferrari 1:03:02
Right! Exactly. What let me ask you, then, what is the monetary situation like? Are we still using paper money? is gold. The thing? Is Bitcoin and crypto?

Stephan Schwartz 1:03:13
Well, what they describe is that's actually a question I asked. Currency still exists, I think. But when I say to people, if you go into a store, how do you pay for something? They tell me, you either pay with your fingertip an iris picture, or some of them describe a chip that's incorporated in your wrist that that you use, or you use what sounds like a kind of advanced version of the iPhone. But no, very interesting. People. When I say well, does money still exist? Cash money? And they say, Well, yeah, sort of, but nobody uses it.

Alex Ferrari 1:04:13
Got it! Well, it's kind of that's kinda today, like most of

Stephan Schwartz 1:04:18
You can see we're moving toward that.

Alex Ferrari 1:04:20
Yeah, cash is not a thing. I got

Stephan Schwartz 1:04:24
Exactly. I've got I got two $20 bills I've been carrying around in my, on my money clip for, I don't know, maybe two or three months.

Alex Ferrari 1:04:33
Right, exactly. And unless I'm in a space where I need that, that that doesn't accept a credit card or I just use my phone and Apple Pay it or something like that.

Stephan Schwartz 1:04:43
I use my paypal debit card. Right, exactly.

Alex Ferrari 1:04:47
So so it's still credit. So who is the financial powerhouse, or is there such a thing in 2060?

Stephan Schwartz 1:04:57
Will ask the question that way so I'm not

Alex Ferrari 1:05:00
Well, I mean, like, obviously the US is right now, the most powerful financial country

Stephan Schwartz 1:05:07
No that we are still powerful. Yeah. China has become much more powerful. countries which have done the best preparing for climate change, New Zealand, Holland, you know, Europe, they've pretty much made a commitment to get rid of the internal combustion engine by 2035. As you think about it, that's, you know, yeah,

Alex Ferrari 1:05:39
California just said that, I think yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Stephan Schwartz 1:05:44
So what you're seeing is, the blue state Red State split is becoming greater and greater. I did not understand it. When I began doing the research. clearly enough, myself, I didn't anticipate how powerful it would become. So I didn't ask a lot of questions exactly framed that way. But what they do say is that, as I said, power has devolved down to states or groups of states. And I think that's because the blue states are doing a better preparation for climate change than the red states. And they're also getting tired of paying for the failure of the red states.

Alex Ferrari 1:06:31
Is there any place in the US that will be more safe as far as geographically from climate change?

Stephan Schwartz 1:06:39
Yes. In the Northwest,

Alex Ferrari 1:06:43
In the northwest, really?

Stephan Schwartz 1:06:46
And I think also, I haven't been up to Maine to do a lot of remote viewing. But I suspect that northern latitudes in general. And I mean, we can already see that the drying up of the Colorado River, Lake Mead, Lake Powell, the huge water problems are beginning.

Alex Ferrari 1:07:10
Is that going to be a major issue in the future?

Stephan Schwartz 1:07:13
Wars water is going to become? What I say is water is destiny. It's going to become a huge deal. cities like Phoenix Tucson, Albuquerque Vegas, I think you're going to become basically uninhabitable. Somebody will be there. But but they will not be hugely growing cities. Although, as of today, people are still moving. They're just like people are still moving into Florida.

Alex Ferrari 1:07:42
That's it because well, in the desert states, there's water there. Vegas is a desert. Without Yeah, without the

Stephan Schwartz 1:07:50
Colorado River problem is a huge problem. And Lake Mead, Lake Powell, I mean, and the hydro electric is becoming a problem. And so, again, what I see is three big internal migrations away from the coasts. Both river coast, Lake coasts, sea coasts. I mean, cities like New Orleans, I think are largely doomed. Hawaii. Parts of Hawaii, yes. So away from where there's too much water and away from cities and states where there's not enough water and where temperature has become an issue. I mean, there. I've seen studies that talk about Phoenix's having 100 days a year with temperature over 114

Alex Ferrari 1:08:52
Geez, I've been in 119 at Palm Springs in my god. It was like living. I was there for a few hours and I was dying. Yes, exactly. Like how can you live in that situation? You can't.

Stephan Schwartz 1:09:05
That's the point. So you got all these people that are moving in to these areas still, who are then going to be moving out. There will be a multitrillion dollar collapse of real estate.

Alex Ferrari 1:09:23
Canada is going to be really great looking good.

Stephan Schwartz 1:09:26
Canada is going to be looking good. Yes, yes.

Alex Ferrari 1:09:29
Yeah, Toronto is going to be a place where you could actually go and live because everyone's like, Oh, I would love to move to cannabis to 10 cold, but in 3040 years, it may actually be just right.

Stephan Schwartz 1:09:41
Yes, yeah. I mean, I live in the Pacific Northwest on an island. And we are already seeing substantial climate change occurring. Just long, warm falls, which unlike anything, I've been here 15 years years. And the weather this last year has been significantly different than the preceding years.

Alex Ferrari 1:10:10
Stefan, let me ask you Is it and I think I asked you this, but I want to ask you again, maybe in a different way, is there any large spiritual awakening? And what part does religion even have in this? 2050s 2060s? Ah,

Stephan Schwartz 1:10:23
Well, different.

Alex Ferrari 1:10:26
Two different questions. It's a different questions,

Stephan Schwartz 1:10:30
Religion, people are falling away from it by the truckload by the busload. And that's because Christianity in the United States, has become largely a white supremacy, male, dominant crystal fascist cult. And so young people particularly are leaving the church in great numbers. That's one thing spiritually or in terms of consciousness, I think there is a an awakening that takes place on the 2050s 2060s describe it, but I can see it happening now. I just wrote a paper on on how we are beginning to recognize that we live not in the kind of Abrahamic world of the Bible, where we have dominion over the earth. And it's kind of like we got left a bank account by a rich uncle. And instead, we begin to recognize that we live in a matrix of consciousness. And that how the matrix, how we deal with the matrix has an effect not only on the matrix, but on us. I mean, just, for instance, take an example of the bees 90% of our food is, is pollinated by bees, and they're dying in huge numbers. So it's going to become a big issue. But we begin to see that, that research that dogs, gorillas, octopuses, and even plants all have consciousness, and learn things and can remember things and different kinds of consciousness, but all have consciousness. I don't think of it as spirituality, I would say, there is a cultural awakening of consciousness, to recognize that we live in a matrix of consciousness, and that we must develop technologies, which acknowledge that we must plan our businesses, our sciences, everything has got to be or reorganized to acknowledge the existence of the consciousness matrix. Because the technologies that we're using, like carbon energy, are destroying the matrix, and therefore destroying us. And so what I see in the 2050s and 2060s, particularly in the 60s, is that they have a consciousness of being in a matrix of consciousness

Alex Ferrari 1:13:10
And in other words, they're, they're really have a better understanding that they are, we're all connected. And we all have to think

Stephan Schwartz 1:13:17
All life is interconnected and interdependent. Exactly.

Alex Ferrari 1:13:20
So basically what our ancestors were doing on the on the plains, you know, hundreds of 1000s of years ago, we're going back to that, but with a little bit more technology. Yes. It is. It is fascinating. I just had a curiosity is because meat consumption is such a issue with global warming. Is that a thing? Is people still is that? Yeah, I'd love to just if the if you have any information about that,

Stephan Schwartz 1:13:52
Consumption goes way down, and a laboratory made meat based on plants comes forward.

Alex Ferrari 1:14:03
So it's kind of like what we're doing now

Stephan Schwartz 1:14:05
Where you can see it happening. What what is what is happening is and it's but it's not uniform across the country. Some states are waking up. They are recognizing that is the people in government, that universal health care for instances is the way to go that that universal minimum income is the way to go. That gender equality is the way to go. And other states that are dealing with you, yeah, that still stuck in white supremacy. Women are dominated by men. I mean, you just look at it with the abortion issue.

Alex Ferrari 1:14:57
Sure. Yeah. And this goes around The world as well, I mean, because right now, I mean, you could go, you can go to countries, like in the Middle East who are saying everything you just said, and you know, we can't even walk the streets. So there's parts of the world that are a little more evolved than others. It's not going to be a global.

Stephan Schwartz 1:15:13
No, it's not virtual. Yeah.

Alex Ferrari 1:15:16
Not at least 2060. Hopefully, in the future, but not right now.

Stephan Schwartz 1:15:20
Maybe further on in the future. Yes. But what I really get is the real fundamental answer to your question, which was the way they described it was the United States still exists, but in form, but the real power has devolved down to states and groups of states,

Alex Ferrari 1:15:46
But still work together as a country, if something somebody's gonna attack it, someone's gonna

Stephan Schwartz 1:15:51
Still working together in some ways as a country, but I get the sense. Well, you know, I mean, Mississippi, for instance, I mean, if it weren't a part of the United States, it'd be a third world country, correct. Or Alabama, you know, they've been very poor states, correct. Not only poor, but they're so badly governed, that when you look at, you know, what I do, and you can go to academia.edu, and get my papers, or research gate.com And get my papers, or Science Direct, or PubMed, the National Medical Library, all my papers are up there. And I've been doing research now, as I say, for over 20 years, looking at social outcome data, because my interest is how do you foster well being. And when you look at when you look at I mean, for instance, a woman, a pregnant woman in Louisiana, would do better to deliver her baby in Botswana Africa, have a better chance of surviving both her and the baby than in most of Louisiana, Alabama, or Mississippi. I mean, that, that social outcome data is horrifying. The educational stuff, you know, we have a whole movement in the country to stop public education and turn it into a kind of indoctrination process. It's all very fascist. So some states I think, are going to are going to go into crisis. You can already see as a result of the Dobbs decision, that physicians, for instance, are moving to other schools, because they can't get the training they want. Your I think you're going to see a lots of young women, fertile young women moving to states where they are treated as equals. So I think what we're going to see in 2060, I didn't actually ask the questions quite disturbed, because I didn't, I didn't see it happening quite this way. That limitation is mind, not the viewers is that some states are going to prosper and do well. And some countries are going to prosper and do well, the Scandinavian countries, the Netherlands, New Zealand, they're going to prosper. Other country, Africa is going to become a much more powerful force than it is now.

Alex Ferrari 1:18:39
Why is that, by the way, what changes

Stephan Schwartz 1:18:41
Because of raw materials, and because it's got a growing population, and there's going to be a mega mega mega GoPlus, that is going to grow up along the coast. As I say, the raw materials, China recognizes this and is, and with their Belt and Road thing is going to they're pouring in huge amounts of money to try to establish themselves in African countries, we're not doing that. So there's going to be a big shift geopolitically, as I say, China is going to become a much more powerful force. You're going to see other countries, that kind of fascist countries, hungry, for instance, or IBAN. All of that kind of governance is just inferior, because it produces inferior social outcomes. And so as this schism becomes greater and greater, we're going to see those countries which are embracing awakening and dealing with the matrix of consciousness and planning for it. They're going to prosper and making Conversion away from carbon energy. And other countries are going to continue to make profit. They're only social priority. That's going to be the real determinant. And they're going to go into crisis,

Alex Ferrari 1:20:18
Which is what's happening here in the United States.

Stephan Schwartz 1:20:21
And you're gonna see these migrations.

Alex Ferrari 1:20:23
And corporations, it's already happening, corporations are changing. You know, the corporations of the 80s and 90s can't exist in the same way in today's world, because of the new generation, the new generation just won't put up with it. Yes, exactly. Yeah, they want change. They want all they want.

Stephan Schwartz 1:20:41
Next election that just happened, you know, the anti abortion is, or basically the anti female equality people have made a major mistake, they thought they would get Dobbs would get overturned, and then they would pass all these laws at the state level. And everybody would kind of forget about it, and life would go on. But that's not what happened.

Alex Ferrari 1:21:02
Nope.

Stephan Schwartz 1:21:06
So so we're going to be very different in the future. And

Alex Ferrari 1:21:11
I mean, I could talk to you for hours, I would love to have you back to go deeper into this conversation. Because it is, it is fascinating, to say the least I do truly appreciate your time. And I have a few questions. I asked all my guests really quick questions. What is your definition of living a good life?

Stephan Schwartz 1:21:32
Are you asking me?

Alex Ferrari 1:21:34
Yes, these are questions I'm asking you personally.

Stephan Schwartz 1:21:38
With every decision, oh, in fact, let me say this, because this is my out.

Alex Ferrari 1:21:43
Okay? Okay. Sure, go for it.

Stephan Schwartz 1:21:48
Culture is the result of individual choices. That's what creates culture. That's why the Japanese cook garlic differently than the Italians. Right? It's a result of individual choices. Therefore, every day you make hundreds of little tiny choices, the toothpaste, you buy the toilet paper, you buy the gasoline, you buy whatever, and you buy it from those companies, and that is of a kind of vote. I urge your readers or your listeners or viewers. Every day you make these little choices, take the time to learn who you are doing business with. And whenever you are faced with one of these choices, at the moment that you have to make the choice pick always the one that is the most compassionate, life affirming, and fostering of well being, as you understand it in that moment. And tell 10 Friends, that you're doing it as a discipline, and invite them to join you and tell 10 of their friends, that you will do it. And if the people that are listening, or watching this show, will commit to doing that they will change the outcome of the 2024 election, so that it fosters well being the key is every individual with every choice, you're either voting to foster Well, being compassionate, life affirming, well being, or you are voting to support something else. And if you support compassionate, life affirming well being, you're on the right side, and you will create a world which is compassionate, life affirming, and fostering of well being.

Alex Ferrari 1:23:55
Seven, where can people find out more about you and the work that you're doing? And your books,

Stephan Schwartz 1:24:00
Go to my website, Stephanschwartz.com You go to Amazon and search on my books for relative to what I just said the eight laws of change. You go to academia.edu or research gate.com or PubMed, or Science Direct and you can get my hundreds of papers. You can go to YouTube, and search on my name and you can get hundreds of interviews. And I publish a daily web publication committed to fostering well being called Schwartzreport.net.

Alex Ferrari 1:24:40
Stephan, it has been an honor and privilege and so much fun talking to you and I hope our conversation is that little pebble being dropped in in the lake and hopefully there's some ripples that come out of this out of this conversation and helps the world my friend. I appreciate you and the work that you're doing to Save to save the world and help the world move forward.

Stephan Schwartz 1:25:00
Oh, pleasure to do it. Glad to do it again.

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