Awakening Through A Course in Miracles (ACIM) with David Hoffmeister

Today on the show we have best-selling author and A Course in Miracles (ACIM) instructor David Hoffmeister.

David Hoffmeister began his journey to spiritual Enlightenment in 1986 when he encountered A Course in Miracles and recognized it as the tool he had been seeking for a radical transformation of his mind and perceptions. In the early years, David studied the Course with passionate intensity, often reading it for eight or more hours a day.

After two years of this study, David began to seek the company of other students of ACIM, attending as many as five groups a week. He was startled to find that a Voice was speaking through him with great authority, so that many began referring their questions to him.

Among family members, friends and teachers, David was always known for questioning everything, rather than accepting conventional answers. Thus he was delighted to find in the Course support and encouragement from the voice of Jesus for his careful examination of every idea, belief, concept, and assumption in his mind. Jesus became David’s internal teacher, answering his every question, guiding him to hand over the day-to-day management of all relationships, circumstances, and events in his life, and providing inner discernment.

David and I discuss his journey, work with A Course in Miracles, nonduality, using movies to teach spirituality and so much more. Enjoy!

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Follow Along with the Transcript – Episode 024

Alex Ferrari
I'd like to welcome to the show David Hoffmeister, how you doing, David?

David Hoffmeister
Hi, Alex, great to be here, I'm having a great time.

Alex Ferrari
Thank you so much for coming on the show I, I've, I've, I found you, in my travels, on the internet. And I, when I discovered you and your work, I was like, oh my god, I would love to have a conversation with David, and really get into his amazing life story, as well as your teachings and the work that you do with A Course in Miracles. Because you seem like a very unique soul in this in this world. So I was like, I need to talk to him. So before that, let's just get started with Can you tell me your origin story? How you came upon this work and and what you've been doing with your life with your life so far?

David Hoffmeister
No, I think it was, it was probably in the mid 1980s, where I was in. I was in graduate school, and at the very end of grid of bachelor's degrees and things and I actually just started getting in touch with these deep inner feelings that that I know you've had in so many of heaven, and it just started drawing me and drawing me and then I started having, feeling more guided prompted to do some things. And then I'd say, around 1986, I started, my heart started opening up so fast. And that's when I was asked to go out to a humanistic psychology conference out on the West Coast in Southern California, La Jolla. And Carl Rogers was there Virginia Satir, a lot of transpersonal, psychologist, people I'd never met. And then I found this book A Course in Miracles, when I was out there, and it just I felt like a, like a tsunami of love washed over me, like your life is never going to be the same, you're going to go in kind of a unique direction that you never plan for. And you never imagined even. And then that's that really got me going. I mean, I just started having huge experiences from that point on.

Alex Ferrari
Now, is it true that you traveled throughout the US and Canada, depending on the universe on God to provide money and food and shelter during this time that you were doing? Speaking engagements and teaching.

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, it was kind of the early part of the speaking and teaching because it was almost like a like in Australia, sometimes they talk about walkabout. You know, it was like a walkabout except it was a bit of a walk and drive and more of a drive about Canada, which was still the same adventure for me, because before it happened, I could feel something big was happening. And I was pretty shy. And you know, I took family vacations and everything, but I wasn't exactly somebody who likes to travel even, or who was really adept at traveling, certainly not. In that way, you know, without credit cards without money and, and then I got the inner prompts to, to I have just a little bit of money, not no savings, or anything really just a small amount. And I was guided to go get a little three cylinder car. And, and take off and head west from from Cincinnati, Ohio. And that launched me into this long period, I didn't know at the time, it would it would last for some years for like five years of just complete almost like a walk about like I mentioned where I had to trust for everything I didn't have any kind of organizational support or like a church support or anything. I didn't have CDs or money markets or dividends or savings. I just got this strong I was impelled to hop in the car and start traveling and that's when the miracles started happening. I felt like I was carried along in had these wonderful encounters. But I was taken into people's homes and it just was so against my kind of my white Anglo Saxon Protestant work, you know, work for everything you do and save. And you know, I couldn't have even imagined that it could even happen. And yet it started happening. And it went on for four years. Actually.

Alex Ferrari
Were you when you went on that when you began that journey, that five year period in your life? Were you just beginning in the Course of Miracles? Were you still learning it or were you really fairly accomplished at that point and you felt real comfortable in it? Where were you still searching because it seems like a walk about or a drive about is an internal Sergent to look inside. yourself, is that kind of happened for you in those five years?

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, I mentioned going to that humanistic psychology conference in the course coming. And that that was in 1986, in the summer of 1986. And then this was happening, like in the springtime of 1991. So this was like, fast forward five years of using the book, you know, kind of using it like an Oracle, you know, pray, pop it open, oh, my god, I can't believe it again. And again, I kind of wasn't, I mean, I read it through and through and practice it and everything, but I used it as an Oracle. And I was just staggered by how direct the guidance was to every question I would have. And by that time, I was, I was getting internal, some internal directions. I wasn't like hearing a voice that was, you know, dictating me my entire travels, but I was getting a lot of internal intuitive guidance, a huge amount. And I think that was teaching me to kind of now Okay, alright, you've been working with the book. Now. Let's go have some fun. Let's make this real practical. Like, I want you to follow what I'm going to tell you to do, explicitly, and without making exceptions. And at first, of course, I had all the reactions, you might imagine anybody would you mentioned, Oh, you gotta be kidding me. And that I'm gonna die. You can't travel around the United States and in Canada without support or credit cards, or, I mean, I didn't even know how I would put gas in the car or wherever find food. I didn't know about lodging. It was the most impractical thing ever. But I felt there was a big important purpose too, for me to be really dependent, like, like, almost like Peace Pilgrim, or some of these, one of these classic Sanyasi is from India or something. And I thought, wow, this is steep, but I will hop in the car and I will drive west, as you say, and we're just gonna see where this goes.

Alex Ferrari
It's fine. There was a there was a series on Netflix, I don't know if you ever saw it, where there was a multimillionaire who decided to go on the road and just at the whim and dependent on everybody. And it was such a beautiful show. I absolutely my wife and I binged it, it was so beautiful. And at the end of the episode, he would give out money to these people who had no indication that he was a rich man by any stretch. I found that's such a be such a wonderful piece of entertainment. Which brings me to my next question, because I'm an I've been in the film industry for close to 30 years. And I saw on your on your YouTube channel, that you do movie watching as a form of finding enlightenment. I need to ask, how do you find enlightenment through watching movies? Because I've seen many movies, no enlightenment, just yet. I'm working towards it.

David Hoffmeister
That's a great question. Yeah, I know your of your love of music movies. I, the way I was told from spirit was that when the great masters like Jesus spoke, he would often have to teach in parables, because what he was teaching was so far beyond everyday perception that he needed to use a lot of examples. And so you know, there was a man who had two sons, and this and that. And I'm like you I love movies. And I love all aspects of it. I collaborate with people who, who even do like a guided movie, they've never done a movie in their life. They don't know all the technical aspects like you do and your courses, but they are so prayerful that they actually have a channel the movie, were given a vision five years before the movie and then actually said, How will I know when it starts? Well, they will appear and you will know and and you're the director and all this and that. So for me, though, movies are the modern day parables, I think. I thought, wow, Jesus used parables, but in a most spectacular way to really get at the core lessons underneath. And I said, most people I know love movies. And if you can channel through me from that high, high, high state of mind, while I'm showing a movie or doing commentary on a movie, if you can comment on all the scenes that are impactful and all the show the distinctions that are necessary for spiritual awakening through the movies, then I'm all I'm in for it. I'm willing, and that's how it started just by love of movies. But first of all, I was taken to the movies and then internally Catch this. Did you see that the internal dialogue, the internal conversation was unbelievable. It was so amazing. And then I just started to like, share it. recollect a gift,

Alex Ferrari
I think one of the most important movies of the last 50 years. And I know a lot people listening might think it's weird, but the matrix, you know, it is an action movie and, but I feel that it's one of my top three of all time, and I find out that that movie did something to the consciousness of humanity, where it was the first time that you questioned what is real, what is not. And it was completely disguised inside of a killer action movie, you know, with a lot of fun and story and everything, but, and it wasn't an accident. I mean, that the filmmakers knew what they were doing. They were really pulling from so many different types of philosophies and stories and everything. Can you talk a little bit about that, you know, the matrix and what it if you if it meant the same thing to you, and how, you know, people can kind of look at that film and gain find that kind of spirituality in it.

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, it had the same impact on me, I, I thought this is so rich and, and I knew the philosophies in the matrix like the like the back of my hand, I felt it was surreal when I was watching it. And funny, you should even mention it. Because today I was just doing a global zoom thing with a lot of people from South America. And I went to one specific scene, the spirit was using one specific scene from that first Matrix movie about bright after Neo takes the red pill, and then he's taken back by Trinity and Morpheus and put into the chair. And then there's the cracked mirror on his right hand side. And then he reaches out and touches it and it's liquid, and it fuses together. I mean, it's so loaded with metaphors of, of unifying perception. I mean, I, I talked about that one theme for maybe 10 minutes today online, in great detail. And I typed in quantum physics, I brought mystical Christianity, I brought psychology, integrating the mind and everything, all using that one scene, one specific theme, because that movie lit me up, like nothing I've ever experienced. And then that's been like the floodgates, then of course, Truman Show and revolver, and on and on and on, kept coming. And I thought these are the easiest movies to teach with. I find that this is my niche, you know, being able to give commentary, and point out insights and do teachings while people are engaged in the graphics of the movie. And so it's, it's kind of just fallen into my lap.

Alex Ferrari
That's, that's amazing. When I was thinking about when I was watching you do one of these, I was just like, This is why didn't I think of this? This is amazing. This is it's, it's brilliant. It's brilliant. And I might in the future, think about how to like, because I actually have used the matrix I've used Shawshank Redemption. I've, I've used, you know, these kinds of films and talking to people just as a, you know, you know, one on one, about these things. But even like, yeah, if you want to really illustrate this, look at this scene in Shawshank. And you know, when he's going through the, you know, when he's going through the literally the mile of crap, you know, and he comes out and it goes, that's how a lot of us feel because we feel like the world's against us. And we were looking for freedom. I mean, you could start going deep into it. You can wax poetic about these things for long times. But it's really it's really fascinating. Now, there was something in your teachings that you talked about, which is the perceptional problem. Can you kind of discuss that a little bit?

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, it's kind of reminds me like in the Bible in Corinthians, where it says you're looking through a darkened glass, and you don't see clearly, but you will. And to me, perceptual problem is saying it's the lens through which we're looking, that is filled with judgments and opinions and all kinds of personal interpretations based on our unconscious mind our conditioning from the past that distorts the world. So I know you and Matt, were getting into the thing about good things happening bad things. And you know, you were saying like, well, you have to get hit by a car. You know, that's pretty obvious as an example of a bad thing. But but when you get back to the idea that the filter that you're perceiving the world through is where the error is, it's in the filter, and it's not in the thing itself that you're perceiving. Because it's the world is not really external. It seems very external to the human being. But when you go into the deeper states, like I see Yogananda behind you awake, right there when you get into samadhi states and you get into these, I call them revelatory states where I I've had three, where the world just disappeared, I went into this blazing light, and there just was just love. And that's all there was. And I was aware that this was the whole point of everything, then you start to go, Hmm, so so it's the lens and not the specific, because we're so used to as human beings trying to just handle and deal with what's coming at us, in terms of the form, and this was a perceptual problem is starting to realize that, that I'm, I'm perceiving something that's not actually there. I'm perceiving it in a fragmented, distorted way. I'm perceiving it in a kind of a schizophrenic way, where I'm hearing multiple voices, but instead of their, their people talking, they actually seem like real people. And, you know, it starts to be like, you start to have glimmers sometimes people have it in, in, like when they take Ayahuasca or when they have a psychedelic experience, where it's like, Oh, my God, the perception of the world is so different from their everyday, ordinary day of day to day perception. That's where you get a glimpse of this perceptual problem kind of in a direct, firsthand way.

Alex Ferrari
So we're basically in Plato's Allegory of the Cave, essentially, that's, that's, that's our existence. I mean, Plato back then figured that out. And I love what you're gonna understand once he's like, you know, when I go to the movies, you see, villains being villainous, and good people being good people and people dying, and murder and all this kind of stuff on the screen. And that's where our focus is, he goes, but what you need to focus is on where the light is coming from in the theater. And I was like, Oh, wow, that's pretty that hit me pretty. When I heard that. I was like, anything that deals with movies and storytelling, it really hits me, because that's what I've dedicated most of my life to. So when I heard that, I was like, Oh, God, he's absolutely right. Because we focus so much on this every day stuff. That is an illusion, it is the allegory of the cave. And, and we really need to not do that as much. And I think that's the hard part. Because I was saying in another conversation I was having earlier today is this is extremely intoxicating. This, this the reality that we live in is extremely intoxicating, very much like The Matrix, like, you know, like, I know, this is not steak, but I don't care. And he takes a bite. Because at a certain point, you're just like, well, I don't care if this is real, or if it's not real, I'm enjoying it. I'm enjoying my time here. If some people are enjoying it, others aren't. But you do agree.

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, I think I think that we have to go through a number of like opening experiences before we get a little clues kind of like in the matrix, you know, he goes through a little follow the White Rabbit and, you know, lots of different steps before he actually gets that phone call that package you know, when he said his cubicle, you know, I can guide you, but you must do exactly as I say suddenly, it turns experiential. You know what, now? Stand up, do it slowly. But now, yes, now, they're coming for you. But you know, it turns suddenly into practical. Like, it's, it's right there. You're on the cutting edge of spiritual awakening when he's listening to Morpheus. But I think we all have to go through quite a lot of preparation, maybe symbolic experiences to even get to that point. And I think it has to be practical. I know. You're very practical. And that's the beautiful thing. And we and to give you an example, with moviemaking. I was traveling, you know, like I do 44 countries around the world and all these places. And one time I was out in California, and they some friends of mine said there's a screenwriter who's a he's a very big name, well, well known screenwriter and he's done amazing movies like ghosts. And he's he's got this movie that he did called Time Traveler's Wife and I said, Oh, I love that movie. I just, oh, it just takes me in and my heart burst open. And I feel by the end of the movie, I'm transported i It's I call it a masterpiece. I said, you don't. You don't have to know anything about spirituality. You just thought it's a love story. And you go so far beyond the everyday love. And they said, Well, he's he lives out there. He wants you to come to his house and meet him and talk about spirituality. So great. I love California for that. So I go there. I talk with him. We're having a beautiful chat. He's just beginning to get into doing spiritual classes and having people come to his house and teach, you know, meditation and he's kind of excited. You know, he's been a script writer. He's dabbling in spirituality now and loving the teachings. Some students, and I, we started talking about Yogananda and I mentioned that movie awake, because I see it there. And I'm like, wow, wasn't that a great movie? And he said, Who? Know, I didn't really like it. I probably need 1000 people and I say awake and, and they go, amazing. Spectacular, touched my open my heart and everything. And I was fascinated, I said, I said, really? I said, wow, it's the first you're the first person I met that said that to me. And maybe you can explain. He said, Well, I went to the theater here in Northern California, I think it was around San Raphael. And I was in the theater. And I watched it, and it was the whole movie. And then at the end of the movie, I just kind of got up and I walked down the aisle, and people were talking at me, like, how can you just get up and whether credits aren't even finished, you know, there's like a sacred experience. And he just was walking up. And I said, to tell me your take? And he said, Well, he said, I said, What didn't you like about that movie? And he said, too many mystical experiences. And I said, really? And he said, Wow, he said, that that had that got so into the mystical, and I thought, well, that's Yogananda as far about so you're not I mean, that's, that's his life. But then he said, he said, I like to reach audiences and touch audiences. From the storytelling perspective, who have never had a mystical experience in their life, who, who don't really know even a lot about spirituality, you're not well read, they're not well versed. And I like to tell a story so well, that their heart opens up, just through the movie without lots of special effects, without lots of, you know, mystical experiences and everything. And I thought, wow, that is so beautiful, because that is an art in itself. I mean, you and I, we know there's some movies that you can't get them out of your mind. They're just so well done. It's just explicit. And I thought thank you for I said, thanks for sharing that I said, I said, I really appreciate that. You have a calling. And you do it so well. Like ghosts, Demi Moore and Patrick Swayze be Goldberg that's, that's classic. That's like a classic screenplay and Time Traveler's Wife. I said, I said, You do what you do so well. And he said, What do you do? Why do you like movies so much? And I said, Well, I actually teach spirituality through the movies. And he said, I can't even imagine that. This is like, a screenwriter who's, who's doing it like the back of his hand, without even trying, and um, he couldn't he he just thought of spirituality as Okay, in a box. He couldn't put movies and spirituality together. It was like outside of his profession.

Alex Ferrari
Yeah, it was, it seems that he was. I mean, I remember when I first picked up Autobiography of a Yogi and I read the first few chapters. And when he when I, when I read the chapter of like, his master, being in two places at once, I started to like, wait, what, wait, what's going on here? And I wasn't ready yet. I really wasn't ready to understand what that was. But it was still calling me that book was calling me and his teachings were calling me. And it was, you know, I understand his point of view of the mystical, because he's also a little probably too grounded still here. And where we're at. It's really it's just really interesting, because, you know, Jesus was mystical. Most Yogi's have some sort of mystical, you know, Buddha was mystical I, there's, there's things about things, but I understand his perspective. And when I with what I do with my work, I try to stay grounded as much as humanly possible, purely for the fact that if you start going off too far, you lose the mass. Do you find that same as well?

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, that's what I've appreciated the most over these last 35 years with the course is that, that it's not something that we we learn through a book, it's it's something that we learn through faith and through experience through trust, facing our fears, letting the unconscious come up and and dealing with it in a very prayerful, intuitive way. So I totally agree with that, that when I've given talks, sometimes I've given talks to like 500 people, and I just kind of like Yogananda did that story and Autobiography of a Yogi where he showed up and and he couldn't speak the language where he was speaking and he just prayed and prayed and prayed to His guru and then his guru came through him that kind of how I feel like all of us have to live our life like with our, with our families, with our friends, with our children, in our professions, whatever we're doing, we have to just be so willing to let it intuitively pour through us so that everyone is blessed. And and we can't really rely too heavily on the past to do that. Because the past is our preconceptions and our limitations in belief. So I totally agree with you that that I want. I wanted to bring such a big blessing and blessing that everybody can feel and I have to really be surrendered to do that to really be truly helpful.

Alex Ferrari
You know, it's interesting, I, you know, I've had the pleasure of speaking to some of the greatest screenwriters Oscar winners, and, you know, legendary television writers. And I always asked him same always asked one question the same. I go, Where is Do you feel moment when you're writing this masterpiece? Like, like, you know, ghost, let's say, if I if I had him on my show, when you were writing ghosts? Did you at one point feel that it wasn't you writing it anymore, and something was coming through you, or you've dipped into some sort of well, that nobody else has access to is your well, and it's coming through you. And when you're writing, you stop writing. And you look back and you read that and go, that's fantastic. I don't know who wrote that. Because that's happened to me with my writing. And I and I would write and I would just go, who wrote this? This is like, this is just not bad. You know, it's my flavor. It's definitely coming through me as a filter. There's no question. It's me. Yeah. But it's not me. Do you feel that as well with your work, like almost a channeling?

David Hoffmeister
It's it it does feel that way? Yeah. I feel that and I can I just get so absorbed in it. That like whether wherever I am, whatever I'm doing, it can be in a grocery store can be in a laundry mat, it can be anywhere. It's some of the stuff that pops out, I just, like I'm listening, for the first time to it. Like to same kind of reaction like, Wow, great, great stuff. You know, this is really great stuff. And then I find, oh my gosh, I'm saying it's happening so much that I that you start to feel real humble, in the sense that, that you see that? It's like in good hands, so to speak. It's like you and Matt, were talking about the plan, the plan of the Great Awakening and everything. It's really well designed for us. And we're just discovering it moment by moment. And it is spectacular.

Alex Ferrari
It is it is an you know, we're living in unprecedented times, there's no question is in my lifetime in yours. We are more separated, you know, than ever before, not just in the United States. Also around the world, there's so much separation, and everyone going into their own corners societally by country by, you know, by different tribes within the country, if you will, whether it be religious, whether it be national, you know, whether it be political, there's so much separation, I find it fascinating that the only reason we as a species have gotten to where we are is because of cooperation. Humans can't survive without cooperation without without helping each other being of service to each other. That's why we have endorphins that get released, when we give, it feels so much better to give than it is to receive. And it's not just a saying it literally is science, there is something that happens when you do that. What do you think we get but also on the same token? There's never been more in my opinion, people searching for something more people looking for? Is this all there is? What am I doing with my life? And I think the pandemic really shipped, it clearly took the world and like an etch a sketch, shook it a little bit. And people that's why there's mass killings, and people are changing careers because there was a moment of reflection, then the whole world at the exact same time, was able to do nothing to human human history. Has that ever happened? So where do you think we can go to stop the separation and start to come together to to give to each other to be empathetic with each other? As opposed to like, ego, ego, ego?

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, I think like your podcast has as its purpose, you know, exploring the deeper questions Who Am I? How did I get here? What is my purpose? What am I called to do? And I think everyone has those questions from time to time I think maybe for like you and I have circles around pretty fast and maybe it was just because of We were ready maybe to let those into awareness more whereas a lot of people are feel very burdened by the world and by the way, their life is that they can't really allow those into, into awareness very often. So I would say that the pandemic and what seems to occur but the great resignation with economics, everything is kind of working part of a greater plan to start to go much deeper. You know, the unexamined life is not worth living kind of the, and the people like the Henry David Thoreau and all the mystics in the poet's in the saints that have been really exploring these deeper questions very sincerely for centuries. I think now the readiness is coming because of the conditions. It's like conspiring to bring us to go deeper into what our life's calling is. And it's like an acceleration. In fact, the scribe of course, in miracles she heard for it even started, she heard, you're a part of a celestial speed up where people are being called from all over to take their part in a greater plan. Because the world is worsening. This was back in 1965, the world is worsening, to an alarming degree. I was saying to a group Well, if it was a worsening to alarming degree in 65, what do we got going on here? 2022. I mean, you know, Okay, we're ready for that. So let's do speed up now. But actually, I feel that that even people who had to endure lockdowns and, and their whole daily life was changed by it. I think that gives I see Yoda is over there.

Alex Ferrari
Always, always had a little Yoda.

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, little Yoda. Mini Yoda. You know, that's the wisdom is waiting for us to call on it to make appeal to it to come to us as an answer to our psychological strife and suffering. So in one sense, I think, even though things seem to be getting a lot worse, I think it's more that we're, we're ready to start taking it in and start applying it, you know, not just as some theologies that we've read in a book, but I mean, in a day to day way, in a real practical way. So I feel like it is, somehow it's working together in a good way. And I do find like you that more people are, are more open than ever, you know, to some of these ideas, I find a lot of receptivity to the things that I'm sharing now, people are quite curious and interested.

Alex Ferrari
Yeah, you've been doing this for such a long time, I can imagine that at the beginning. When you started, it wasn't nearly as open. People weren't nearly as educated or even open to accept this kind of these kinds of teachings with this kind of knowledge. And now people I've seen it, even in my lifetime, where, you know, when I was born in the 70s, you know, my mom at that time was meditating. In my, in my Cuban, you know, family was like, She's crazy. What is she doing? Like it was so far beyond, it's like us driving, you know, going back to 1815 Go, there's gonna be an airplane, what? There's gonna be a car. It's so far beyond their comprehension, that it couldn't happen. But now, you know, something like meditation, which was, you know, to my understanding was brought over by Yogananda to the west, he introduced meditation introduce yoga, he introduced kriya, yoga, to the west. And before him, there was no meditation. No meditation, there was definitely no yoga, or now, yoga is, is everything, you know, we think more now yoga is aimed more at the physical than it is the internal, but it's still available. And meditation now is my God even in the last 10 years? How much of have we been open in meditation? Can you talk a little bit about meditation in your, in your practice what you do on a day to day basis? And how has it changed your life? And when did you start and all of that because it I've been meditating now? Probably, at least six, seven years heavily. And it's transformed my life completely.

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, I think that's one of those perennial techniques and means that the Spirit calls us home with because it's about stilling the mind and it's very directly about stilling the mind, you know, being able to hop off the trains is the, the trains of thought go by, I find that that all kinds of different spiritualities incorporate that in some way. Even when you talk about like an open eyed Zen meditation where you are observing the world in a metaphor The way with your eyes open, that's a little bit outside the traditional bounds of meditation is it's brought by Yogananda but I do feel like the whole point is for us to go into this real connected, reverent aligned state of mind, whether our eyes are open or closed, and come into a very Stillpoint like that Stillpoint that in which guidance can come through in which we can be animated by the higher power of like you were saying, even writing or speaking, I see it in sports, when people talk about when they go into zone. Oh, and talk about it. So with such joy, you know, oh my gosh, I everything slowed down, it was like slow motion. And, and I love hearing it. Kind of like Abraham Maslow talked about self actualization, and, you know, how it happens, and, and what are the characteristics of it, I like hearing about it in a lot of ways. So meditation has been a big part of, of my life, and it's kind of evolved more to a state of mind and less to physical practice. Because, like you said, even with yoga, it can, it can move more to the stretches, and the postures, and it can still incorporate quite a lot of the physical. But Yogananda was a great example of like, oh, it's all taking you into a glorious state of mind. And that's the whole point of it, it's a means to reach something. And in the course of miracles, Jesus calls it a miracle. And he's got quite a lot of words to, to tell us about the miracle to coax us into it to, to merge into it to be used by it, and have it move through us. And so for me, meditation has more now is the state of mind. I feel like my days are, are very, very meditative. But, but also, I'm kind of like, I'm like, the observer more, a little more like the ultimate observer than I am. A feeling of being a human anymore. It's my appetites had fallen away, you move more, like Yogananda did kind of at the end of his life out there in, in California, when he just started to go into Samadhi. And all the monks around him, you know, he would say, just whisper in my ear. If I go, if I'm gone for a long time you get it, right, and just hear it say, say, I'm in my ear or something, and I'll come back. But for me, that's my I'm kind of in the tractor beam of something very high. And it feels more surreal. Every day. It less less earthy, less horizontal, it feels more like a verdict, something vertical is very strong. But to me, meditation is part of that vertical, you know, it's like, oh, yeah, I recognize you, my friend.

Alex Ferrari
Yeah, it's funny, because you know, as I've met, been meditating, more and more things that used to be important to me are no longer important to me, especially in the physical world. And I've started to like, and that's a pull away from the physical world, because I still, obviously, I mean, I have a family and have kids and all this kind of stuff. But it's different. I think I like the way you like, the observer. I'm becoming more of that than the participant. If that, if that makes any sense whatsoever. I'm not saying that I sit there and I don't participate in life. But the I just look at things so differently. It's almost like I was talking to somebody the other day saying, The fog is slowly lifting the haze, I'm starting to see things a little clearer. At least from my perception, I think things are starting to make more sense to me. When people act certain ways. You go, okay, that that person's in pain, that person is dealing with trauma. You know, why? Why else would they go online and write a negative comment? That's five pages long. I'm like, wow, you've you've got some work to do my friend and because I don't know you and you don't know me, so obviously, this has nothing to do with me. And I'm sure you've dealt with that in your life as well. I mean, people coming in and trolling and all this kind of stuff. And my god, the internet has made it so easy for people to do that where before you couldn't. So it's it's really fascinating. It's really fascinating. Do you find that as well? Do you find like that kind of almost attachment, but yet still involved in it?

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, that's it. I feel like I'm, I'm completely in the middle of everything and yet, strangely, kind of watching it. At the same time. It's like it's, it's more of a feeling of like, the simultaneous nature of this. There's a The joy of the moment that all the Mystics and Saints that talk about the present, stay present. It's like an experiential thing for me like, wow, this is a discovery I am excited every every day to, to discover this present moment and all that it entails almost like unpacking a diamond and looking at all the facets of the glimmery shiny things of the diamond like I never knew. I never knew it was it was right here for me. So I I also like these synchronicities, you know, where everything seems to be handled, I've had so many synchronicities that have occurred over my life, where it's like, I'm watching it, and it's everything feels perfect. Like it's in some kind of divine water. And, and if that's an amazing feeling, considering our human experience was nothing like that, we weren't thinking about divine orders. You know, we were like survival, emotional or physical survival was our, our thrust. So for me when there's lots and lots and lots of synchronicities, and I really see that it's not coming through any efforting of David the person, I'm more beholding it, and marveling at it, like, oh, my gosh, this is so amazing. And yet, there's no sense that I did anything in form to make it happen. It's just showing itself more and more.

Alex Ferrari
It's, it's fascinating. I, you know, I started the show a little while ago, and it started an Easter of last year. And it has grown much faster than my other shows ever did. And I have two very popular shows in the in the film industry. But I had one foot in and one foot out. So I was just like, I don't want to say spirituality, I don't want to, you know, I was still on the fence. I knew I was being pulled in that direction. But I was still like, I don't want to, I don't want to yet. And I was able to get some, you know, very nice guests. And I was able to and had pleasant conversations. But when I would go after certain people, or just like reach out to people wouldn't get responses. Literally, last week, I'm not exaggerating, literally last week, I said, Alright, I'm all in. I'm going to build a set, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do this, right? We're not going to monkey around anymore. Let's do this. And then I just emailed a bunch of people that I wanted to have a conversation with like yourself. And I'm gonna say 80 to 90% said yes. And is substantially like, I'm booked up now for the next two, three months, like, solid. And then now they're actually coming. And I'm like, What is going on? What is this? Like, I don't, I couldn't believe like, it's like, oh, yeah, this person, this person, this person this and I'm like, and then like, I literally got an email today. I was like, I represent these three people, would they would you like to have them on your show? And I'm looking at them like, of course I would do these, of course, I would have conversation with them. So it's just so fascinating that once I gave in to the, to the to the flow of the river, let's say the doors just swung open. And I've had that's happened to me a few times in my life. But specifically with the show and with what I'm doing with with this new company. I just found it so fascinating. Like literally when you emailed me and said, Hey, I'd love to be on your show. I'm like, Hey, I got an opening tomorrow. Great. I'll talk to you then. I was like, What is going on? So it's a lesson for people to learn when there's an inner voice pushing you in a certain direction. Are there signs in the world when you should probably do that? You should probably do that. You kind of don't fight it. It's so much easier when you don't find it.

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, I think that all of us kind of where we dabble in spirituality then gets more important to us and more important, but there's still a bit of like, okay, I've got my worldly life over here, uh, practicalities that I have to deal with and all the logistics and specifics, and then this spiritual realm thing that's just opening up. And that's where sometimes we hesitate a little like, you know, not quite ready yet. No, no, no. Then you say the Yes. And then, lo and behold, things just start to drop like raindrops coming down. You know, so easy, so effortless. And I think when we just take that little thing right there and we realize that that could transfer to everything in our perception. It means that that our life can be more glorious and so easy and flowing in the river than then we could ever imagine. And and the spirit is just like calling us to just say yeah, I just was waiting on your yes, that's your consent is required. That's all I need is your consent your Yes. And then watch. I will show you I can show you the world. Fantastic one. Interview. And the Spirit's just waiting for us to give that nod that Yes. And then here it comes. So it's quite exciting. You know, I mean, with you with your podcasts, it's just that's a perfect example of how it works.

Alex Ferrari
Yeah, it is. It is. It is exciting. And it is kind of strange and, and I'm bewildered by it, but yet I'm not surprised by it at the same time. It's just just like, it's remarkable when you do give yourself into this. And, and allow it to flow. And this doesn't have to just be in spirituality, it could also be in, in your purpose in life, whether that be writing screenplays, like, like your friend who wrote ghosted, or, you know, it could be opening up a business, or it could be whatever that thing is, that you're supposed to be doing. That's why I think there's so many people who are angry and upset because they've, they had something like, I really, if I could do anything in my life, I really would love to write, I really would love to play that music, or I would really like to, I really want to open up a cookie company, but I'm a lawyer, because that my mom, my parents sent me to lawyer law school, but I really just want to open up a cookie company, because I love cookies. You know, like, I don't want to give joy to the world, like with cookies, that I feel that if they just would allow themselves and not worry as much about the practicality. And trust me, I was almost bankrupt. At one point in my life, I was in a very dark place. It was in a depression for two or three years, after a certain experience to happen to me in my life, which I wrote a whole book about. But then, when you finally gave in to that, and just said, Hey, it's okay. Everything's gonna work out. Because I got to a place where I had no other choice. See, that's how far the universe will take you like, Okay, if you're not gonna go, we're gonna take you down all the way to like, either you're going to live down here in this misery, or you're going to open up the doors, please just say yes. And the second I said, Yes, it was funny when I was in that bankruptcy. And I was two days away from signing bankruptcy. Lost my girlfriend. Yeah, my dog died. I mean, it was the it was everything. The biggest opportunity of my career had gone away. And I literally yelled out to the universe, I said, Look, I want to pay my debts. But if you don't help me, I'm going to sign this these papers. The next day, I know, the next day, my first boss ever in the business called me up sick. They're looking for an editor up in West Palm Beach, why don't you drive up there and I got a job. And I became one of the best paid editors in the entire state. And it was just so and then I was off and running. But had to get down to that that plays till I finally just gave in. And I think if we give in a little bit more, life becomes a little easier. Do you feel do you find this? Well?

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, I think that's the whole thing about this world is we've kind of we've had it upside down and backwards. And there's a part in A Course in Miracles where we're told, it's not that you asked for too much, it's that you ask for far too little. Oh, my does that flip it around, because it's like, you mean that my own limitations that I've placed on my mind that I've placed on my soul are all being reflected to me, and that as soon as I say, I want to experience at all I want to know, the allness of of my true self, then everything will work straight and turn and conspire to, to bring that about. And it's just so different than what we were raised with, you know, we were we came in survival mode. And, and we were just trying to get by, and trying to make it you know, we weren't asking for a lot. We were just asking to survive day by day. And the universe is like saying, Well, you might want to take some of the parameters off and go big. Go for the Hail Mary.

Alex Ferrari
You know what, I'll tell you what that is. The thing that I found in my life as well is that I always thought too small. And I and I was like, oh, you know, I really wish I could get this person on my show. And I'm like, it would really be in the start. I was talking to a mentor of mine. And she said, that's almost irrelevant to where you're going. It's almost irrelevant. Yeah. Like if Steven Spielberg shows up on your show, doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things relevant to what you're doing. I was like, wow. Because at a small level, you're like, Oh, my God and Steven Spielberg, you know, using him as an example. And, and then they're like, no, no, it's Don't worry. Just like, go, let go. And I'm starting to learn how to do that more and more. Now, you also talked about being in the now being in the present and understanding that concept like most of us as human beings do, live in the past, or worry about the future that has yet to come. So those are two things we have no control over. Really, the only thing that we really have to experience is this moment that we you and I are speaking right now, is the only thing that matters in our life at this moment is this right moment. Why is it that we, as uniquely as a species on this planet, are the only species that lives in the past? Where you can literally start making yourself cry from past traumas or past issues or past things? Why is that?

David Hoffmeister
Well, I think from a deeper perspective, that, that, you know, when we go to the movies, for example, because you and I love the movies, theater, we got the popcorn, and we're, we're engaged, we're watching something that clearly has been shot. It's the past, it's just it's been the can, and it's being projected, and we're reacting emotionally, like it's happening to us right there. And that's, I think, the way the whole world is from a much deeper perspective, like, A Course of Miracles that teaches that, that the world is over and gone, it was corrected, the instant that it seemed to arise simultaneously, it was corrected, but you still are trying to drag the past into the present all the time. In fact, it says in the course history would not exist, you didn't keep making the same mistake in the present. My first read that I might take two, what did you say his history would not exist if you didn't keep making the same mistake in the present. There's another lesson in the course, where I think is lesson 158, where he says, we would take undertake a journey that is already done, you are mentally reviewing what has already gone by. So it's like the our higher self is, is there and it knows it's a movie. And our ego self is going no, it's happening to me right now I'm in I'm in middle progress between past and future. And our higher self knows that it's all been corrected. And we simply have to accept the correction in our mind. So we have the avatars and saints who did it, you know, and we know it because of the essence and the presence that came radiating through them. You know, it's before Abraham was I AM, you know, that Jesus said, he was basically saying, Who I am the Christ presence, the I Am Presence is prior to time. But while we think we're in it, we experience guilt. We, like I like to talk about quantum physics a lot. So I do things in that way. And, and I like to talk about hypotheticals, because basically, the future is definitely hypothetical. You know, we can surmise what will happen in the next moment, or surmise what will happen in the next year. But it's hypothetical, it's as if there is a future there, and we don't know what it is. So we're looking at all the possibilities. And, and we don't really accept it, it's just potential. So there's a part in the Course where Jesus is talking about the as if you know, you live as if the past is real, and the future is real. And he's telling us that it's possible to, to transcend that to actually allow ourselves to be lifted beyond that, like my grandfather, you know, he was born in 1898. And he was the twinkle in his eye and he was light and happy and everything, and he would watch me watching football games and baseball games. And I'm like sweating, I'm sweating, the armchairs up and the Restless that call, and my team would have scored if the ref hadn't blown that call, and this and this, and he would sit there with the biggest smile on his face. And he would take one finger up, and he'd look over at me and he go, yes, are just word in the English language. And I would look at him like, what, and now 35 years later, the course. My grandfather was teaching me to come and be present. He was teaching me about hypotheticals that I was all emotional bent out of shape about what could have been different. And I wasn't accepting what is you know, I was rooting for my team and I was against the ref for this and this could have happened and he would just laugh and laugh and laugh at me embrace this one figure and keep saying to me, if if and so that taught me a lot about now what I'm experiencing that, that if we're really present, we don't have that stress of the what the coulda, woulda should have from the past or the F and possibilities of the future. We're very content. We're very joyful and gleeful. But it's a deep problem to hold on to these hypotheticals. And in the end, I think that's what the whole trap of linear time is. It's as if we fell from grace. It's as if we separated from God, this is an as if universe, you know, like, in the multiverse, this is the as if separation has happened. pandemics, tsunamis, earthquakes, fires, murders, rapes, you know, it's extreme. It's an extreme as if scenario. I was kind of fascinated when I was reading something about a month or two ago, and they would say, most scientists are now believing that this world is some kind of simulation. Right? Right. I was like, really scientists, and it's like, 90 95% have this feeling in their heart that it's a simulation, but they don't know how it's working. In other words, many of them will say, they think it's like an advanced race. That is playing with humanity. Kind of like making, like The Matrix, like The Matrix. But this is an advanced race that for for entertainment, they are using, you know, that's as far as the scientists can go like, there's probably some advanced race, it's having a lot of fun at our, at our mercy, you know, but with with A Course of Miracles, it's like saying, No, it's, it's actually not an advanced race in the future. It's his ego. It's this belief in separation. It's this even call it Satan. You can call it darkness, you can call it ego. It's just a belief. It's not a reality. It's just a belief in separation. And then then Jesus says, it's unconscious. That's why it's so mystifying. You know, you you look to your behaviors, and you think, This is bizarre, even we look at our life, and we go, that's a bizarre life, I would have never seen myself getting into so much trouble and darkness, I would have never thought I consciously would choose something like that. But the stuff that, you know, the shadow that Carl Jung talked about, you know, it's it's so dangerous because it's out of awareness. And we need to, we need to bring it into awareness. But we have good tools. Now. We've got meditation, we've got great teachings, we got great, great metaphysics, great inspiring teachers. And we have great movies coming out to the Truman Show. You know, it's, it's all on a loop, Groundhog Day. I mean, you know, that there's all these Looper movies, I mean, I've got a thing called the movie watchers guide to enlightenment, that must have maybe 15 Looper movies, just because we can see it much more clearly when it loops. You know, like, there's one called every day, you might have heard of that, where it's a female character, and it loops. But you can see it so much more clearly. When it loops like that, right? Out the loop movies, Oh, are we lost, you know, it's almost like we're just swimming in a sea of potentials and possibility to keep our head above the water. So I like that, we're kind of now getting the deeper under underpinnings of it all that we need to release this ego, if we're going to really be loving, consistently loving, we have to really let it go.

Alex Ferrari
There. I mean, you've you've spoken around the world, and you've you've probably spoken in front of 1000s 10s of 1000, hundreds of 1000s of people at this point in your career, if not millions. And you know, when you're meeting people, in your even in your own everyday, you know, journey, I find that the more angry or the more traumatic someone is dealing with is they're farther separated from their themselves. They're farther separated from the source. You know, so you can go all the way off to murder and violence and things like that. And then you know, it just in general, what can we do to find, to find that inner voice to go deep inside for the questions, as opposed to look for answers outside and when when you have so much trauma, that's where drugs and alcohol and vices and workaholic and all these other things, they're coming into play because you're searching for something to take you out of the pain, because you're not in the bliss of being connected with who you truly are. What advice do you have for people looking for that?

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, well, I talked about how it's, it's a perceptual problem, but what I discovered was that in any given instant, I have some options in my mind of which filter or which advisor I'm going to follow. And basically, I was shown that that in any given instance, there's, there's three ways of looking at it. And three ways of experiencing it. Three ways of interpreting it. The first two, which is good, two out of three come from the spirit. And the third one doesn't. So I'm like, Okay, tell me more, I need to know, what are these three things, it's basically first one, everything's either love. Or number two, it's a call for love. Or number three, it's an attack. And when you bite the bait on number three, where you perceive yourself attacking or being attacked, then come all the defense mechanisms, and they're very fearful. And psychology tells us Freud started telling us and now we really understand there's a lot of them. But when we're in defense mode, where we've we've bought the the perception of attack, hook, line, and sinker and, and it's not pretty, and we don't behave or feel very well at all when we perceive the attack. So but look at the first two, everything is love, or a call for love. If I can train my mind with my intuition to to rely on those two, because let's face it, it's the first one is love. We know how that feels. We can feel it when we're with people. It's very obvious whether it's our pets or our friends or a family, or just somebody we meet on the street and we feel whoosh. Like we're surrounded by love. It's, that's that's the most obvious. But the call for love is like saying, don't buy what the surface mask is presenting. Because underneath that anger, angry face underneath that pointing finger. There is is a soul calling for help. It's calling out for love. It's like behind the mask saying teach me teach me please remember how innocent I am. Please remember how how loving I am. Don't buy the bait. Don't look at the surface. Kind of like in The Wizard of Oz, you know the famous wizard of oz movie, pay no attention to the man on the screen. And yet toto goes and pulls the curtain and shows the frightened young, the frightened wizard who's who's basically using this big projection to induce fear. And ego, which is the ego obviously the ego. Yeah. So to me, that's what my life has been like is I've traveled the country, I go to these different continents and, and countries that I don't even speak the language. A lot of times I know nothing about the culture, I'm just like, being dropped. With one reason to see that everything is love or call for love. With every house I go into with every person I meet with every place I go with every movie I see, it's to see that everything is love or a call for love, and practicing that. So you have to really let go of your attachments to do that. Because to the extent that you're attached to the past, or you're attached to an outcome or an expectation, you can't stay in love or call for love. You know, you you will take things personally like Miguel Ruiz, you know, the agreements, you know, don't take anything personally, that's one of the Four Agreements. And I'm like, That's what I want to practice. i If I could just practice that one of the Four Agreements consistently, learn not to take anything personally, then I think I could be peaceful. And that's what I've tried to give me my life of risk to like really go for that. Let's let's really see if this is true. You know, not just some theory. Let's just give it a go.

Alex Ferrari
I, by the way, love that book. I love the Four Agreements and the mastery of love and a bunch of his other books. He's just, I truly believe those are channeled. They're beautiful, beautiful books. I want to just ask you quickly about forgiveness, and the power of forgiveness. Because so many of us carry around this resentment, this anger towards our parents, towards our spouses towards people who've wronged us and you know, like they say the I think it was the Buddha's, I don't know who said it, but you know, the only time you when you hate when you hold resentment, the only person you're hurting is yourself. You're not obviously hurting the other person. What can we do to let go of that to forgive even if it's quiet, within ourselves to forgive, to forgive the person who who wronged you so, so much what can we do?

David Hoffmeister
Right I think the thing that has been most helpful for me is like, like everything i It's like redefining forgiveness, because we've all grown up with some kind of a perception of what forgiveness is, you know. And, and the common perception of forgiveness, which I think makes it so difficult is, you've really wronged me, you really, really, really wronged me. And somehow I have to find a way to let that go or to, to not harbor that anger of being abused or victimized by you. And so, of course, miracles has a whole different view of forgiveness, it's basically says, forgive your brother for what he did not do. Come back and what say what he's saying, No, it's a perception you, you have a thought in your mind of victimization, or of mistreatment, and you have a belief in mistreatment, and, and the world acts out your beliefs. You know, it's it's like a motion picture of your consciousness. So, in order to forgive, you have to release it. It's like, Jesus would always tell me when you get upset, David, why don't you consider plucking that grievance from your mind? Like, get the tweezers out? And actually get in there and pluck it out and remove it, give it to me, he I can remember, I know how to handle it, I can, I can take that grievance from you. But as long as you hold on, and you want to be right about that grievance, then he says basically, no amount of evidence will convince you of what you do not want. If you don't want to let it go, then you will just continue to accumulate evidence. Oh, did you see that? And I wrote him a con letter. And you see what I got back there? And did you see that? Look? I mean, I went over there to hug them. And did you see that look in their eyes, as long as we still deep down still want to be right about the grievance, then our mind is so powerful that we call forth witnesses to prove to us to give us evidence for that belief. So in the end, to me, forgiveness is really about coming to purity. That's what Jesus said in the Sermon on the Mount. He said, Blessed are the pure of heart, for they shall see God, that purity is so important. And that, to me is what the essence of forgiveness is. It's whenever I'm still building evidence like but they said this, they did this, you know, and Jesus like, he's like, David, every time you point the finger at somebody else, you've got three fingers pointing back at you. I said, okay, and he goes, one for the father of one for the son. You got the Trinity reminding you every time you've got a finger pointed at somebody else, no, no, come inside here. Let's come back to the innocence. Let's come back to the love. And to me that I have to practice that though it doesn't do me any good as a theory, I really have to take it to heart and practice it,

Alex Ferrari
Isn't it isn't it, you know, to kind of finish our conversation going full circle with movies. I always believe that, you know, we are in a movie. And we are like Shakespeare said actors in a play on a screen. And the the insanity that we have as this this experience of being human, you know, spirit, a spiritual, being having a human experience as opposed to human experience, a human being having a spiritual experience is that we, you know, you see actors being the bad guy being the good guy, hurting people loving people, all this stuff. If actors would literally believe that that was true, and they would just can't let go of that character. So you know, once that cat that Keanu Reeves will always be Neo. And he just believes that that's, that's the real world. Where in reality the actor puts on it puts on a coat puts on the character plays the character, when the movie is done, they walk off and they go into the reality where we are stuck inside the matrix or stuck inside the movie playing these parts that we have cast ourselves in. And yet, we can't understand that this is a movie that we need to eventually understand. It's it's not real, or this is not the real stuff. This is the matrix. This is not what you know it the steak tastes good, but it's not real. Do you find that to be true as well?

David Hoffmeister
Yeah, I think one time I went to the dictionary and I just spirits that look up the word act. And I said, Okay, so I looked it up and said, you know to impersonate and I think of this movie. Chances are we're civil Shepard, you know is in the bedroom and she's got the pillow and she's Hitting Robert Downey Jr. You know, and she's used, you should be arrested for impersonating a person because it's a reincarnation movie. And he's now back saying he's Louis, her husband, you should be arrested for in person in person. And I thought, That's it because like, they're great actors like Richard Gere, you know, Buddhist and very deep and inward. And he said, that he's sees how the spirit or the life has shown him through acting, that it's just a series of parts. And he's actually used his career to start to detach from the identification with the parts. And to me, that's, that is really insightful, you know, if we can start to apply that he's somebody who's acted in many parts and is quite renowned for all the different movers. Yeah, but but for him to say that is so beautiful, because it's like an insight for the rest of us. You know, if Richard here is going through that, then maybe we can go through the same experience and, and not take it so seriously, when people are saying something or doing something, we can actually be quite calm. And and say, Okay, what from presence? What would I give here? What would I offer? Yeah.

Alex Ferrari
Now, I'm gonna ask you a couple questions. I ask all my guests, what is your mission here in this life.

David Hoffmeister
But it seems like I'm genuinely trying to be happy. And I mean that in the in the most altruistic and mind expanding way, not kind of in a narcissistic, way, as a happy as a person, but more genuinely happy, you know, to live the Beatitudes to live the what spirit Woods wants me to live. And so I do find myself very playful. I was like, I, I was doing an online session today with people from South America. And I had this tree over here. And I started pulling the tree over and, and talking session from inside the tree. And I find the playfulness, and the lightness is is the great gift that we offer. We know the humor, why can't we laugh, learn to laugh? Why can't we start to see like, The Divine Comedy of things? Why can't we just laugh for no reason at all? Why do we need to have a joke to laugh? Why can't we start to see the silliness and humor in things? So to me, that's, that's my mission is to be genuinely happy, genuinely

Alex Ferrari
Great, great answer. I agree with this. Is this the absurdity of what we have to deal with every day here? You better laugh? You better laugh or hope? And why do you believe that we are all here as as as a species?

David Hoffmeister
Well, I think it's, it's to learn the lesson of true forgiveness. I mean, I think that that's we have to face what's in front of us. Like, even if even if I say it's a movie, we still have to, we're responsible for our state of mind. We're responsible for our heart condition, you know, we're responsible for how we feel, in the ultimate sense. And so I think we're here to learn to release illusions and accept the truth. And, and I think we can do it every day. I don't think this is something where we need to just say the words like some kind of declaration or pronouncement, but we, we want to have an actual experience of what that would be. And, and we're here to discover that

Alex Ferrari
David it has been such a pleasure talking to you. I mean, I could talk to you for hours and hours. And I'm sure we'll have you back on the show, again to keep talking because it's just been such a wonderful and enlightening conversation. So thank you, not only for being on the show, but for the work that you're doing. And you have done in your in your lifetime and continue to do and all the souls that you're trying to help out there. So I do truly appreciate you my friend.

David Hoffmeister
Thank you, Alex. So when this one comes out, I will keep an eye out for it and spread it around so so people can feel your presence and what's your about now and your big Yes. Everybody can start to rejoice in the yes and all the guests, the guests that will come in.

Alex Ferrari
I appreciate that very much my friend.

 

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